D&D 5E (2024) The Great Wizard Extinction.

Illusionists get decent stuff. Minor illusion as a bonus at 3 is genuinely good and two free summons per day is ... worse than morphing illusions but a decent bridge.

They do they got a heavy rewrite. Other 3 not so much. They're the best one imho.

Compare the new playtest 4 with the other 3 phb wizards. We will see how much they change by final release.

If im completely off my rocker why are WotC power creeping the wizard?
 

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They do they got a heavy rewrite. Other 3 not so much. They're the best one imho.

Compare the new playtest 4 with the other 3 phb wizards. We will see how much they change by final release.

If im completely off my rocker why are WotC power creeping the wizard?
They're power creeping everyone. The Monk got a night-and-day glow-up.
 

They're power creeping everyone. The Monk got a night-and-day glow-up.

Yeah sone classes needed it.

With Tashas style Sorcerers and Warlock boosts Wizards needed it.

Being honest how many people think the Invoker, Abjurer or Diviner are decent if the playtest ones are close to final form?
 

I think its a reasonable statement to make that there are far far more enemies that deal damage than deliver int or wisdom saving throws.
Yes. But do they hit the wizard?
And while you could absolutely run a game just chock full of Illithid...I hope we can agree that is not the typical dnd game.
Never saif that.
Now I am in the camp that says the wizard is just fine, but I do think when it comes to saving throws the con bonus for the sorc is a bonus on top of what the wizard gets.
I thought so for quite a while.
After playing typical games for 10 years, I rate wis saves a lot higher.
 

They do they got a heavy rewrite. Other 3 not so much. They're the best one imho.
Evokers were always underrated.
Diviners have always been great.
The abjurer shield got buffed a bit, because resistance now comes before the shield hp.
Compare the new playtest 4 with the other 3 phb wizards. We will see how much they change by final release.
Ok.
If im completely off my rocker why are WotC power creeping the wizard?
They do not.
The 4 in the PHB are solid.

The 4 to come were comparatively worse. Except for the transmute woth their stone. But they had only one good option: con saves. Now they get that and can chose a minor benefit on top.
 

Evokers were always underrated.
Diviners have always been great.
The abjurer shield got buffed a bit, because resistance now comes before the shield hp.

Ok.

They do not.
The 4 in the PHB are solid.

The 4 to come were comparatively worse. Except for the transmute woth their stone. But they had only one good option: con saves. Now they get that and can chose a minor benefit on top.
Invoker problem is done people think throwing a fireball is a great idea.

Remember the 3.5 Warnage which was super powerful?

5E danage spells are so much worse comparatively.

Diviners good if you roll well on portent. But its very limited in use 2/long rest in an edition with vad saves anyway. Sorcerer can heighten spell a lot more and is better imho. Every sorcerer has that option.

Abjurerers best out of those 3.
 

Invoker problem is done people think throwing a fireball is a great idea.
You think fireball is never a good idea.
I can still acertain you: in our games fireball (especially if you can exclude teammates) is often enough situationally so good, no other spell could compare.
Remember the 3.5 Warnage which was super powerful?
No.
5E danage spells are so much worse comparatively.
Depends. If you use CR < 1 minions frequently instead of scaling minions up to player level, fireball stays useful.
If you as a DM think that if level 10 heroes never face CR <1 creatures as minion and instead think that the world around them scales with them, so that level 10 heroes face level 8 minions or no minions at all, you are correct.

Comparing 3.x and 5e is moot. In 3.x, Creatures of CR 4 levels lower were no threat at all because of number inflations. Also the game probably because of this featured party vs few high level foes quite often.

Now, in 5e a powerful necromance might still have an army of skeletons and zombies around him. Annoying enough to clear them with a fireball.
Diviners good if you roll well on portent. But its very limited in use 2/long rest in an edition with vad saves anyway. Sorcerer can heighten spell a lot more and is better imho. Every sorcerer has that option.
Yes. And they also take twin and quickened and... Oh no, you just get two option for all the levels you count (< 10).

Diviners portent is reliable. If you roll mediocre rolls, one might decide to use heroic inspiration on that. Or just have a relaxing day and kill the boss later.
Abjurerers best out of those 3.
I like abjurers.
Never seen one though. Sadly our game where I wanted to play one was stopped because of covid19. I have seen all the other three in action, and the transmuter. The transmuter was nice to have. Ironically the most iconic features were good con saves and fireballs (in an official adventure) and slow... and highest strength of the whole party... The other ones all did even better.
 


Its offensive that Wizards or Sorcerers can cast and wear armor anyway, or mix Spell Slots between Arcane and Divine!

Grampa Simpson Grandpa GIF by MOODMAN
I mean, that is certainly fair :)
 

Erm Druids and Clerics get armor, dragon sorcerer gets cha+dexterity to AC.
Yes I said almost all. And a single subclass of sorcerer doesn't make your point. Sorcerers, as a generalization, often do an armor dip. Bards, as a generalization, often do as well. I know you know this is not a knock on a full caster for doing an armor dip. There's no doubt you are very familiar with this concept, I've seen you mention it before, you never expressed it before as some knock on the class.

Also, it's not necessary. You can play a Wild Magic Sorcerer or Illusionist Wizard or Lore Bard without an armor dip just fine. The Wizard is good from the bank ranks using true strike with a ranged weapon, and ranged slot spells. They still get mage armor and shield, which is a good AC. The Illusionist can usually get cover/concealment as well. It's not a big deal to not get an armor dip, I just mentioned that I did.
 

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