D&D 5E (2024) Orc lore in the new Forgotten Realms books?

[pukunui]

I like what KP did with their Midgard setting - descendants of humans and elves are "elf-marked". I only have the PDF of the Midgard worldbook with me at the moment (I don't remember if I have the player options PDF). However, I like this idea of elf-marked instead of half-elf. It allows at least a couple things:

• GM/player discussion on what this means in terms of traits, powers, feats, etc
• Accounts for people who have elven lineage way back (in other words not "half" elf, but maybe 1/16th elf)

That’s cool. I recently reread the Dragonlance Chronicles, and there are a number of times where a character wonders if someone else has a bit of elven blood in them.

 

[Parmandur]

That’s cool. I recently reread the Dragonlance Chronicles, and there are a number of times where a character wonders if someone else has a bit of elven blood in them.

I think Wotc really missed an opportunity by not having some form of formalized hybrid character rules in 2024 that would work for diverse combos without the weirdness of "half"-races

 

[djotaku]

I think Wotc really missed an opportunity by not having some form of formalized hybrid character rules in 2024 that would work for diverse combos without the weirdness of "half"-races

which I think takes it back to what someone said about Paizo thinking about these things and WotC not thinking about it. Yes, yes, I've read so many comments (mostly on YT) about how people are so mad about these changes for political reasons. But as you said, if they had a rule that said - "Look, we're getting rid of half-races as a thing. But many of you like the concept of hybrid origins, so here's a way to make that work for any %/% you want" - I think that would have been great. Shoot, given the types of people that play TTRPGs, people would have taken that and run and figured out some weird-ass 23&Me situation where they are 10% elf and 20% orc and 30% human and......

 

[QuentinGeorge]

which I think takes it back to what someone said about Paizo thinking about these things and WotC not thinking about it. Yes, yes, I've read so many comments (mostly on YT) about how people are so mad about these changes for political reasons. But as you said, if they had a rule that said - "Look, we're getting rid of half-races as a thing. But many of you like the concept of hybrid origins, so here's a way to make that work for any %/% you want" - I think that would have been great. Shoot, given the types of people that play TTRPGs, people would have taken that and run and figured out some weird-ass 23&Me situation where they are 10% elf and 20% orc and 30% human and......

Exactly, people aren't annoyed that a specific mechanical representation of half-elves and half-orcs were removed, they're annoyed that it was removed as a character concept entirely. "Just play an orc like any other orc"

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Exactly, people aren't annoyed that a specific mechanical representation of half-elves and half-orcs were removed, they're annoyed that it was removed as a character concept entirely. "Just play an orc like any other orc"

The 2024 don't tell you how to play an orc, or anything else, at all. You can play an orc, or a halfling with orcish ancestry, or a pixie raised by orcs, or whatever. That's supplied by the imagination of the player, not the rules. You just pick the species and background that is the best mechanical fit for your character concept.

 

[QuentinGeorge]

The 2024 don't tell you how to play an orc, or anything else, at all. You can play an orc, or a halfling with orcish ancestry, or a pixie raised by orcs, or whatever. That's supplied by the imagination of the player, not the rules. You just pick the species and background that is the best mechanical fit for your character concept.

Great, so why have any specific species in the Player Handbook if you can just do that? I don't need an elf or dwarf species as a mechanical concept, I can just write "elf" on the sheet after all.

Come on, do you even see what you the objection is at all? Handwaving a loosey-goosey "you can play any concept" is not filling the hole that players can see.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Great, so why have any specific species in the Player Handbook

Same reason you have classes: to provide a range of mechanical options.

I don't need an elf or dwarf species as a mechanical concept

Yep, mechanics has no effect on how you role play your character, how you role play has no effect on mechanics.

 

[TheSword]

Great, so why have any specific species in the Player Handbook if you can just do that? I don't need an elf or dwarf species as a mechanical concept, I can just write "elf" on the sheet after all.

Come on, do you even see what you the objection is at all? Handwaving a loosey-goosey "you can play any concept" is not filling the hole that players can see.

Anybody who has been playing the game long enough to bemoan the loss of half orcs and half elves, already knows everything they need to know about playing a half orc or a half elf.

WotC has taken a position that there is no mechanical difference between an elf and an elf with one or more humans in their ancestry unless they want there to be by picking human as their race.

The suggestion that one parent is X another parent is Z so their hold must be Y is old fashioned and logically unsound. WotC has changed it transparently and consistently. No one has stopped you being a half elf if you want.

You can even go back to source material. Is there anyone who thinks Elrond isn’t a proper elf? Or isn’t elf enough?

 

[Demetrios1453]

Anybody who has been playing the game long enough to bemoan the loss of half orcs and half elves, already knows everything they need to know about playing a half orc or a half elf.

WotC has taken a position that there is no mechanical difference between an elf and an elf with one or more humans in their ancestry unless they want there to be by picking human as their race.

The suggestion that one parent is X another parent is Z so their hold must be Y is old fashioned and logically unsound. WotC has changed it transparently and consistently. No one has stopped you being a half elf if you want.

You can even go back to source material. Is there anyone who thinks Elrond isn’t a proper elf? Or isn’t elf enough?

The Valar.

 

[Voadam]

WotC has taken a position that there is no mechanical difference between an elf and an elf with one or more humans in their ancestry unless they want there to be by picking human as their race.

Have they?

I thought they were planning to do so in the 24 PH and make it an official option but then backed off from doing so and just did not address the issue at all. Has there been anything saying they are actually taking that position? From statements people have said about half elves and such in the FR books it sounds like they have written around it there in a way that does not preclude their existence but does not explicitly acknowledge their existence.

In the new Eberron book my understanding is they are to have half elves with the Eberron name for them but so far has there been anything in a 24 book addressing mixed species species at all?

From the 24 PH it looks like B/X D&D where there are elves and humans but no half-elves.