D&D General The "Ease of Long Rests" as a metric for describing campaigns / DM styles?

[tetrasodium]

Boils down to the same old thing: if it's consumable rather than permanent, they won't use it.

I'm like that as a player as well: I'll never use a consumable item if there's any other option available, 'cause I never know how long it'll be (if ever) before I can replace - or afford to replace! - the item I just used.

Agreed, there's nothing good accomplished by the new rest/recovery mechanics unless the only player of concern is Leroy Jenkins or the one the party tells to "be a team player or else ". Every other player at the table loses out be needing to be the jerk who says no if either of those types of players are in the group.

Those items were given out because they allowed me to say "no [Bob]don't lie to my face like that" with extremely blunt words when players say "we feel like we need it" or whatever

 

[Silam]

I gave partial ones out pretty often in 3.x & I remember it being almost standard to get partial ones occasionally as a player back then.


Come 5e?... it's not a solution for the fatal rest/recovery design problem.
I've given full 50 charge wands of CLW to more than one group of (totally different) players who started with 5e. In both cases I explained that the hope was that they stop pushing for the 5mwd & use it for top offs if they feel they need to then told them that they could buy more & would probably find more while adventuring as long as they weren't straight up leroy jenkins'ing with it.

ad someone say almost word for word "No we can just keep watch & take this rest because we might need it more at some point in the future" the very first time someone in the party suggested they just use the wand because they were still pretty good on resources & weren't down that much. Every. Single Party.

Also tried giving these out a couple times

Spoiler: D12 ones

View attachment 428278

Players flat out refused to use them for anything but yoyo healing backstopped by 5mwd resting no matter what grade of healing potion I stuck in them. The GM can't fix the design problem by incentivizing around it with treasure

Wow that’s cool, I hadn’t seen those flasks before. Makes me think of Asterix’s invincible strength gourd that he carries at his belt and never seems to dry up for the whole adventure

 

[Smackpixi]

I’ve just eliminated the long rest. You get fully restored when you level up, which you can only do in some sort of sanctuary, no tiny huts. It’s worked fine for me, but my worlds and campaigns are largely a series of repurposed “one shots” others have written so I have a good sense of what they will face before that level and rest is available.

Prior to going this way they just always sought out long rests rarely did short ones, never used up all their spells or hit dice, etc. they didn’t nova long rest nova long rest repeat, they both saved the good stuff and long rested. So, at least for my players, this has gotten them both using everything and doing it judiciously.

 

[Silam]

I’ve just eliminated the long rest. You get fully restored when you level up, which you can only do in some sort of sanctuary, no tiny huts. It’s worked fine for me, but my worlds and campaigns are largely a series of repurposed “one shots” others have written so I have a good sense of what they will face before that level and rest is available.

Prior to going this way they just always sought out long rests rarely did short ones, never used up all their spells or hit dice, etc. they didn’t nova long rest nova long rest repeat, they both saved the good stuff and long rested. So, at least for my players, this has gotten them both using everything and doing it judiciously.

It must feel very different. Interesting though!

 

[TwoSix]

I’ve just eliminated the long rest. You get fully restored when you level up, which you can only do in some sort of sanctuary, no tiny huts. It’s worked fine for me, but my worlds and campaigns are largely a series of repurposed “one shots” others have written so I have a good sense of what they will face before that level and rest is available.

Prior to going this way they just always sought out long rests rarely did short ones, never used up all their spells or hit dice, etc. they didn’t nova long rest nova long rest repeat, they both saved the good stuff and long rested. So, at least for my players, this has gotten them both using everything and doing it judiciously.

I've been an advocate for this for a while. If you follow bog-standard 5e XP granting practices, you'll usually level up after about 2-3 long rests worth of encounters anyway. Most long rest oriented classes still have plenty of short rest and at will resources.

The only real change I do is that everyone gets back one Hit Die per in-fiction "day" assuming they sleep, and I tend to give out more magic items that recharge "at dawn" or some other in-fiction time period.

 

[Marandahir]

The newer editions' method also takes away the choice on the second day as to whether to carry on when only partially recovered or to risk taking that second day's rest. Even more so if the resting place isn't necessarily all that safe, as once happened in an old campaign of mine leading to a player quote: "If we rest up and recuperate here long enough, we'll all be dead".

I'd argue that 5E still runs rules on partial recovery and player agency. It's just nested in the "exhaustion" rules.

 

[Marandahir]

I've been an advocate for this for a while. If you follow bog-standard 5e XP granting practices, you'll usually level up after about 2-3 long rests worth of encounters anyway. Most long rest oriented classes still have plenty of short rest and at will resources.

The only real change I do is that everyone gets back one Hit Die per in-fiction "day" assuming they sleep, and I tend to give out more magic items that recharge "at dawn" or some other in-fiction time period.

I prefer more encounters and short rests between Long Rests, but I've also eliminated direct XP so leveling up after 2-3 long rests isn't a thing that happens. We level up when it feels right for the narrative and party, based on accomplishments and quests completed etc.

 

[tetrasodium]

I'd argue that 5E still runs rules on partial recovery and player agency. It's just nested in the "exhaustion" rules.

You don't sound very convincing when you can't even describe the rules in question while telling others to go find the rules you are referring to

 

[Retros_x]

IMO ease of LR is super overlooked by many DM. The complete game balance is heavily influenced by resting. If you don't use long rests as intented some classes definitely get much stronger than others. Difficulty per se isn't affected as long as the players can have influence on the moment to rest. And the vibe of a campaign completely changes with ease of rest. Its ok if a DM doesn't understand all the implications of the game system, but this can lead to the gameplay not supporting the targeted vibe of the campaign at all. For example a gritty, survivalist game - but long rests are permitted always and everywhere. This is a mismatch.

 

[tetrasodium]

IMO ease of LR is super overlooked by many DM. The complete game balance is heavily influenced by resting. If you don't use long rests as intented some classes definitely get much stronger than others. Difficulty per se isn't affected as long as the players can have influence on the moment to rest. And the vibe of a campaign completely changes with ease of rest. Its ok if a DM doesn't understand all the implications of the game system, but this can lead to the gameplay not supporting the targeted vibe of the campaign at all. For example a gritty, survivalist game - but long rests are permitted always and everywhere. This is a mismatch.

Ime it doesn't even matter at that point because the warlock sorlock pallylock bardlock and monk have guilted their group into joining them on so many short rests "because my class is designed to neeed those just to keep up" that the long rest classes never need to get aggressive enough with resource burn for the eventual long rest to matter.

Sure those short rest classes kinda needed them in the early levels when the party is hunting rats in the basement and whatnot but continuing that ceases to be true somewhere in tier2 & is comically broken in tier3+