Karma, Rewards /Consequences Do you use it? If so, what is good, and if not what is bad?

[aco175]

I think it was a Matt Colville video that said "You get what you reward". It is a bit of a powerful statement similar to the old saying about getting more flies with honey, in that it works in many places and not just your game. It works on children and online with people giving you little pats on the head for doing something someone else wants you to do.

Also sounds a bit like D&D and faction points or renown. You go around doing things for your specific group and the DM gives you a cookie or pat on the head. Collect enough of them and you can influence things around you in the game.

 

[1QD]

I think it was a Matt Colville video that said "You get what you reward". It is a bit of a powerful statement similar to the old saying about getting more flies with honey, in that it works in many places and not just your game. It works on children and online with people giving you little pats on the head for doing something someone else wants you to do.

Also sounds a bit like D&D and faction points or renown. You go around doing things for your specific group and the DM gives you a cookie or pat on the head. Collect enough of them and you can influence things around you in the game.

Rmm I'd say you are part right. I try and reward good gaming, good roleplay and team work.

 

[Umbran]

If you have problem players, address them directly like an adult. Don't make a game out of it.

I agree.
Negative stimuli are not nearly so good a teacher as people seem to think.

 

[1QD]

I have heard the position that this form of mechanic could become a deterrent. Yet, if used properly I have to also question, what kinds of players do you have that would consistently cause them to get enough -karma in the first place. For example, harming fellow players. I can not think of too many situations where that kind of behaviour is conducive to the story, or good game play. It acts as a deterrent for people running into a room and casting FB, and in turn harming all the rest of the characters and possibly destroying any would be treasure? The system I use for example requires 10 such acts before any negative ability is applied. In a combined 15 years of gaming with this mechanic, I have only ever handed out 2 maybe 3 -karma abilities.

That said, a deterrent which is applied in this way is easily understood with a range of ages of players. If you are an adult, this will most likely not be an issue and therefore, there is nothing to worry about.

 

[Deset Gled]

In a combined 15 years of gaming with this mechanic, I have only ever handed out 2 maybe 3 -karma abilities.

If you have only done something 2 or 3 times over 15 years, why would you even bother making a formal mechanic for it? Your argument here undermines any reason for even having these rules at all.

If a GM introduces a new mechanic and it doesn't matter in play for 5+ years, the GM is not teaching his players new rules. He's teaching his players that it's not important to bother learning the rules. And that's coming from one of the people on ENWorld arguing in favor of more complex and crunchy rules in other threads.

 

[RenleyRenfield]

So I have introduced Karma as an optional rule in my system. It is often used as a reward system, and even other players can suggest karma if the occasion calls for it. I have brought forth the idea to other communities who abhorred the idea, claim there will be excessive favouritism, over reach and control. This has not been the case. In the twenty six years I have been using it I can count the number of times I have awarded a negative Karma ability on 1 hand. In counter I have awarded over 300 Karma abilities.

Seems to me then that negative karma is not needed then? Used so little...

My point for using karma is for awarding good behaviour such as , saving character lives, sacrificing loot to help further the story, and player who put in a lot of effort.

I would never reward players for this. But then again, I would never reward players for good behavior. ever.

And if a GM wanted to reward players for what the GM though was good behavior = red flag. I am out, never playing with that GM ever again.
IMHO.. A person does not get to decide how another person is doing good in roleplaying. You are either fine, doing whatever you do to have fun, or you are a detriment to the table and are taken aside for adult time talk.

But to think of a person deciding each game if a player was doing well this game, but not that game, but this situation, but not that one... no thank you.

Negative Karma is used to deter argumentative players, or ones that disrupt gameplay. ( As mentioned I game with adults , so this is extremely rare.) It is also awarded for in game things such as, killing innocents, damaging the party with aoes or worse yet killing them.

We play a LOT of games. And this would be a fairly hindering aspect to play. Game where innocents die, or get hurt and the player characters are well within their play to do so. Most all of WoD has this potential. But so does D&D and most any other game too.

I think someone here mentioned V5 Chronicle Tenants. Which are great! I ++ for using those. And using C.A.T.S. to start a game too!

 

[kronovan]

The Shadow system in Adventures in Middle Earth (D&D 5e variant), has some features that could be thought of as karma. The ever persistent nature of Shadow can lead to situations or circumstances where a PC may become corrupted. Corruption can occur by traveling through blighted lands, from experiencing extreme anguish, doing misdeeds or by handling tainted treasure. When such a situation arises, a PC must make a corruption save in order to avoid gaining shadow points. If a PC becomes too corrupted (Shadow points equals Wisdom score) they may become miserable and evetually, even mad.

So it's not a meta currency, or a free-hand way for the GM to make things interesting, as the rules around what cause corruption are quite structured. I only ever had one player become mad, but luckily the party arrived shortly thereafter at a sanctuary with a known Patron, allowing that PC to recuperate. Once a PC becomes mad though, some of the shadow points remain permanent. I adapted the system to the Midgard World setting and renamed Shadow to Gloom, to better reflect aspects of that setting's Shadow Realm.

Writing home brewed adventures was more challenging, because when creating locations or events I had to put a fair amount of thought into how corruption might be a factor. It's the same when homebrewing AiME adventures, but the lore around Shadow is more prevalent in that setting, so a little bit easier to write in.

 

[GMMichael]

I would never reward players for good behavior. ever.

What if a player ignores detrimental metagame knowledge?

Or chooses to fail a contest instead of rolling?

Or actually plays her alignment correctly?

 

[RenleyRenfield]

What if a player ignores detrimental metagame knowledge?

This may end up getting them the 'adult time' talk if the group felt it was ruining play, other times it may be just fine...kinda depends

Or chooses to fail a contest instead of rolling?

This is fine with me I see this often in our games! (even more so in Dread!! Push that tower over doood!)

Or actually plays her alignment correctly?

Seems fine?


100% of all of this is covered in C.A.T.S. for how its resolved and treated/considered.

I may not even let the GM be the soul judge of these either.

 

[GMMichael]

This may end up getting them the 'adult time' talk if the group felt it was ruining play, other times it may be just fine...kinda depends


This is fine with me I see this often in our games! (even more so in Dread!! Push that tower over doood!)


Seems fine?


100% of all of this is covered in C.A.T.S. for how its resolved and treated/considered.

I may not even let the GM be the soul judge of these either.

Just checking

Longer version: I expect most players to look out for #1 (the player). So I reward them to encourage looking out for #2 (the character) and #3 (the other PCs).