D&D General Ranger Identity Patch (+)

[Minigiant]

Are any of the other classes in D&D really solid in their identity or have satisfied most of the customer base? Class identity and satisfaction are subjective terms. They mean different things to different people.

Rogue
Warlock
Probably Wizard and Cleric

 

[Corinnguard]

Rogue
Warlock
Probably Wizard and Cleric

A while back, there was some discussion about when a 2024 Warlock should enter a pact with their otherworldly patron. Some posters didn't like the idea of a Warlock having to wait until 3rd level before learning the nature of their Patron. Others were fine with the idea of them waiting until 3rd level. I am not sure this issue was ever resolved.

 

[Minigiant]

A while back, there was some discussion about when a 2024 Warlock should enter a pact with their otherworldly patron. Some posters didn't like the idea of a Warlock having to wait until 3rd level before learning the nature of their Patron. Others were fine with the idea of them waiting until 3rd level. I am not sure this issue was ever resolved.

That still counts as solid in their identity or have satisfied most of the customer base.

The argument for Warlocks is a when. 1st level or 3rd level.

The Warlock is still getting the feature. And in the same tier. Fans like the feature (satisfaction) and see it as thematic (identity).

The problem with Rangers is the mechanics fights and warps the identity because D&D is restr I active at base and powerful in magic.

Think of it this way. 2 Questions.

1) Do you think part of the identity of rangers is the abilty to detect poisons and cure poisoning?

If Yes

2) Can you cure any nonlegendary poision with successful Nature or Medicine check?

Most people say Yes for the first and No for the second. This is because for the most part ranger stuff is not Yes/No and Success/Fail.

There are yes/no classes like Fighter, Rogue, and Paladin.

There are special effects classes like Wizard, Cleric, and Ranger.

 

[Corinnguard]

1) Do you think part of the identity of rangers is the abilty to detect poisons and cure poisoning?

If the Ranger in question has the spells Detect Poison and Disease and Protection from Poison and/or carries a Herbalism Kit, they could be a part of a Ranger's identity. However, several spellcasting classes have these two spells in their spell lists. They're not limited to the Ranger class. And anybody can buy a herbalism kit in order to detect poison and cure it.

2) Can you cure any nonlegendary poision with successful Nature or Medicine check?

There are a lot of variables to consider beyond a successful Nature or Medicine check.

Survival and exploration are a big part of a Ranger's identity.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Not to the point that it both

1) solidifies the class identity

and

2) satisfied most of the customer base


You cant make a good Beastmaster, Mystic Warrior, and Specialized Fighting style Warrior (Both Archer and TWF) in the same class and be simple.

Most 3PP and homebrew rangers either cut out rangery aspects or get complex.

Both the 5e original and 3.5 ranger do it just fine. They literally only fail at being powerful enough, and in the case of 5e it is frustrating to actually use the spellcasting aspect of the class due to all it's good spells being concentration and it's main spell being concentration and lasting an hour. If it was 1 minute with no concentration, I double people would even have complained about the ranger.

Actually, okay, take the damage out of the spell, make the damage buff x/day buff that lasts 1 minute, and add some other utility benefit to the spell. No way to test this, but if there was I would bet serious cash that such a version of the original 5e ranger would have satisfied most ranger fans. Well, at lower levels before you hit all the terrible class features later on.

 

[Minigiant]

There are a lot of variables to consider beyond a successful Nature or Medicine check.

Survival and exploration are a big part of a Ranger's identity.

Those variables are the ranger class.

You need rules for healers kits, herbalist kits, and antitoxins.

It isnt pass/Pass like the Rogue's Sleight of hand (Detected/Not detected) or Acrobatics (Fall/Stand).

Foraging asks how many meals are forged.
Healing asks how many HP.
Taming asks what favor or trick can you ask the best.
Weatherprofing asks which weather can you endure
Group stealth asks how many and how close must allies be.
Resistance asks how many damage types are resisted
etc etc

 

[Horwath]

Actually, okay, take the damage out of the spell, make the damage buff x/day buff that lasts 1 minute, and add some other utility benefit to the spell. No way to test this, but if there was I would bet serious cash that such a version of the original 5e ranger would have satisfied most ranger fans. Well, at lower levels before you hit all the terrible class features later on.

replace HM with Divine favor, improve DF damage to d6 at 13th level, 2d6 at 20th level

give rangers advantage on Insight, Perception and Survival at 3rd level.

 

[Corinnguard]

Both the 5e original and 3.5 ranger do it just fine. They literally only fail at being powerful enough, and in the case of 5e it is frustrating to actually use the spellcasting aspect of the class due to all it's good spells being concentration and it's main spell being concentration and lasting an hour. If it was 1 minute with no concentration, I double people would even have complained about the ranger.

The need to concentrate for an hour on Hunter's Mark is what convinced me to use the optional Favored Foe class feature for my 2014 Ranger character. You just needed to concentrate for a minute with Favored Foe and you were able to use it a number of times equal to your PB/Long rest. And while the extra damage started out small, it slowly scaled up to a d8 by 14th level.

Would Hunter's Mark be OP if you didn't have to concentrate on it for an hour? Just mark and go!

 

[mellored]

Make it a fighter subclass, like it originally was.

level 3:
Mark Prey: As a bonus action you focus on a target. Your attacks deal 1d4 extra damage against target. This lasts for 1 minute or until you use this feature again. (At-will)
Deft Explorer: You can cast Speak with Animals as a ritual. You also have Advantage on tracking checks and your speed increases by 5 feet while you aren't wearing Heavy Armor.

Level 7
Mark Prey increases to a d6.
Expertise
Guerrilla Warfare: when you use Tactical Shift, you can atrempt to Hide and the end of your movement. In addition, you can cast Pass Without Trace once per long rest.

10:
Mark Prey increases to d8
Expertise
Roving: Your speed increases by 5 feet while you aren't wearing Heavy Armor (10' with Deft Explorer). You also have a Climb speed and a Swim Speed equal to your Speed.

15:
Mark Prey: damage die is a d10 (gotta keep the cap stone )
Tireless: Whenever you finish a Short Rest, your Exhaustion level, if any, decreases by 1.
Nature's Veil: When you use Indomitable, you become invisible until the end of your next turn.



Also could use a Bladesinger for the druid. Letting them use Shillelagh on bows.

 

[mellored]

Subclass aside, nature invocations can work. It's not exactly an "identity", but toss enough small ideas in a basket and let people pick and choose works. Hardly makes it cohesive, but it works.


More realistically, the only way I see to "patch" the ranger in the current game is by adding more spells. Though besides bee arrow, I can't think of many.