D&D (2024) Playtest 8: Cantrips

I would retool Friends so it enhances you with an instinct of how to be persuasive, rather than messing with the mind of the target you're persuading.
That would be transmutation, ala Eagle's Splendor (a 2nd level concentration spell).

Friends is just in a weird zone, because WOTC is reluctant to implement anything more granular than advantage/disadvantage, which is already (IMO too) easy to get via the Help action. Friends doesn't DO a lot mechanically you couldn't get with a buddy, but it is in an inherently scummy school of magic. This is a time where verisimilitude cuts the caster for a change.
 

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In my game, a somatic component isn't a personalized thing. It is a specific series of hand gestures for each spell. If the somatic component for Charm Person was "powdering one's nose," it is that way for everyone, and it wouldn't be subtle. It would look practiced and precise, and while a commoner might not understand what it means, it might seem weird and out of place to them, and there may be magic sparkles or mystical effects.

It would be obvious spellcasting.

As long as you are aware that is a homebrew rule, and only applies to your table.

Per RAW, somatic components and verbal components are personalized, alongside the actual visible spell effect (magic missile chickens)

Also, while combat gives PCs 360 degree vision, that isn't exactly how it works. So a wizard doing a precise make up ritual behind someone's back isn't exactly going to make that person instantly suspicious. You don't know what someone behind you is doing with their hands.
 

  1. All Verbal components are clearly spoken and audible.
  2. All Somatic components are clear hand gestures.
  3. All Material Components/Implements are at hand and manipulated.
  4. Sense-obscuring factors, or the range from which the spell is cast if it is far away enough, may be relevant, as they could affect sight and hearing of the spellcasting.
I think it's in Ars Magica where you get the equivalent of +1 on the save required if you are extra loud and shouty about it. I always thought that mapped really well onto the fiction -- there's a reason the enemy sorcerer has a bubbling cauldron and is cackling maniacally.
 

As long as you are aware that is a homebrew rule, and only applies to your table.

Per RAW, somatic components and verbal components are personalized, alongside the actual visible spell effect (magic missile chickens)

Also, while combat gives PCs 360 degree vision, that isn't exactly how it works. So a wizard doing a precise make up ritual behind someone's back isn't exactly going to make that person instantly suspicious. You don't know what someone behind you is doing with their hands.
The "personalized" aspect does not change the rules for Components. They are all very clearly part of spellcasting. Clearly chanting and gesticulating is still RAW, even if personalized.

That said, sure, if the spell doesn't have a Verbal Component, someone who is not in combat with the caster, and is otherwise audibly unaware of the caster, may not see them gesticulate like a muppet. ;)
 

That would be divination though (which I'd be fine with).

Lets face it. Mind control isn't the domain of good people. Friends usurps someone's will to make them like you, much like getting someone drunk to impair their decision making. It SHOULD tick people off, and enchantment in general really should be illegal in places that value honesty and freedom.

I'd fix it by extending the duration, with additional scaling at upper levels, and allowing a saving throw after it ends to realize the magical influence.
I view empathy and insight as inseparable components of social skills.
 

The "personalized" aspect does not change the rules for Components. They are all very clearly part of spellcasting. Clearly chanting and gesticulating is still RAW, even if personalized.

That said, sure, if the spell doesn't have a Verbal Component, someone who is not in combat with the caster, and is otherwise audibly unaware of the caster, may not see them gesticulate like a muppet. ;)

Your interpretation here misses three things.

1) Spells do not require you to "gesticulate like a muppet" throwing your hands in every direction. You typed up the rules, but you seemed to miss something. "Spellcasting gestures might include a forceful gesticulation or an intricate set of gestures"

Firstly, gesticulation is not always wild. It is "A gesture, [especially a dramatic one], used [instead of speaking] or to emphasize one's words" Or, cutting out the parts, a gesticulation can be a gesture used to emphasize words. But, you also miss the entire second part. Spellcasting gestures can also be an intricate set of gestures. And intricate is "complicated or detailed". It could be fair to say that crossing one's self is an intricate gesture. It requires touching your forehead with two fingers of your dominant hand, pulling the fingers down to the center of your chest, then moving to your left shoulder, reversing to your right shoulder, then clasping your hands together. That is intricate, and precise, and most Catholics who've done it for most of their lives can do it in less than two seconds. Or, how about a Japanese magical charm. You hold out your hand, write the symbol for "man" in your palm, and then swallow the man. Precise, intricate... and can be subtle. Sure, you'll notice it if someone is staring at you, but if you are in a crowded room, and you only see them out of the corner of your eye, you might just think they ate something from their hand, not that they did a small ritual.

2) Chanting does not have to be loud. I seriously don't understand (well, I have a theory, see pint #3) why people keep insisting on this. Chanting is rhythmic, musical, or repetitive, nothing about the definition says "loud". Sure, you CAN shout or be loud, but there is no requirement to do so. Chanting is most closely related to music, to singing, and there are sixty dozen videos and lessons out there on how to sing quietly, but with force and precision. This idea that verbal components means the person has to project to the back of the room instead of keeping to even a normal speaking tone is completely not supported.

3) This is really the biggest one, tying the other two together, but it is one I don't see people really thinking about. Spells are designed, in world, by people. By smart people. And they are designed with a purpose. Take this art.

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The caster is what, 15 ft away from that guy? Less? In a crowded room with people listening intently. Do you think she could have cast her spell and no one notice, if, to cast the spell, she had to scream

I AM NOW SUMMONING A GHOST HAND!!!

No? Neither do I. So why would I think that is how the spell is designed? That would be... a poorly designed spell. And who would make and propagate a poorly designed spell? Not people who actually wanted to use that spell, and knew how to refine it.

And think about the types of spells that always get brought up in these discussions. Enchantment spells. Spells meant and intended to affect someone without them knowing. Honestly, think about it. How effective of a spell is it if to cast Friends you had to grab the person, shake them, and scream in their face "I'M ENCHANTING SOMEONE'S MIND HERE!" The only times in fiction we see that for mental magic is on dominate spells, where the point is removing free-will. But a subtle influence spell is always... subtle. Because if it isn't subtle, it wouldn't work.

And, I think that's the point hiding in the shadows for these discussions. The reason I think some people want to insist that all mental magic and debuff magic, and anything that might be useful in a social situation MUST be loud, obvious, and clearly identifiable to all... is because they want to make those spells unusable. What is the point of casting Friends on a criminal in a bar if by doing so everyone within 20 ft is screaming and pointing that you just used magic and you clearly used magic and therefore you need to be stopped because you used magic! There is no point. It renders the spell completely useless, same with Charm Person, and Suggestion, and a dozen other spells whose use cases are clearly meant for the target being unaware of magic being cast on them.

Do they still need to chant and gesture? Sure, but it can be a quite, lyrical chant and a set of small, intricate gestures and that's still following the rules of the game. It doesn't have to be

LOOK AT ME AND MY OBVIOUS MAGIC THAT IS OBVIOUS SO YOU KNOW TO NOT TRUST ANYTHING BECAUSE OBVIOUS MAGIC IS HAPPENING!!
 



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