D&D (2024) Githzerai Psion? Thri-kreen Psion? Where's My Psion?

Marandahir said:

Quite aware, loved that implementation. And I agree, though I'd argue that they intentionally obscure the Psionics of the Monk just as they moved away from outright magical Ki Power, because they want players to be empowered to flavour their Monk as Psionic or Divine or Primal or Martial or something else, without feeling tied to a specific power source,

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Like how the PF2 Sorcerer can be of any power source (arcane, divine, primal, occult) depending on their bloodline.

Ardent is one I don't think can be a class on it's own, as I feel it could be a Psion subclass even if those are built around "disciplines" or as a College of Ardor Bard subclass.

The ki/chi will be replace with "spirit points" to be more generic.

We are too used to the pool of power points and that can't be changed. And other powers with special game mechanic also may have its own power points pool.

The wilder could be like the psionic berzerker but it would need a lot of work to be more than a subclass. The psion is more "I focuse and I shoot the arrow" and the wilder is "FREE THE WAR DOGS!"

Psionic and primal or spirit magic can't be the same. Spirit would be like an appel in the tree and psionic an apple cake. And it could close the door for a future update of the incarnum.

Ardent could be rewritten to be something like a psionic version of the vestige pact binder.

* And psionic powers allowed augmented if you spent more power points.

Frozen_Heart said:

Wait is there actually debate about whether psionics are Int or Chat in DnD? It's been long established that psionics is linked to Int, and not Cha.

Even in the current rules, creatures which use psionics have Int as their spellcasting modifier. Mind flayers, gem dragons, and the even the 'psion' NPCs from the new MM all cast through intelligence.

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int or wis I could see but we have too many cha right now to add another would be madness.

Shigeo Kageyama, from the manga "Psycho 100" could be a good example of wilder, and also Akira, or the famous Stephen King's Carrie. Wilders are more like "free your within rage".

In the adventure about the shatered obelisk, and it is not a spoiler, there are goblins with psionic powers.



The design of the mystic class is not only the list of powers but we need an interesting concept. If a mystic was the main character of a comic or novel, why would like her more than her twin sister with a different class?

Other possible idea is a twisted version of isekai. Somebody from other universe, for example a jedi knight, or a protoss zealot from Starcraft is reincarnated in a D&D world, and with autodidact training can "remember" how to use psionic powers. Other times this soul doesn't earn a new corporeal body but she can find somebody with a special bond, creating a simbiotic link like the binders and the vestiges thanks pact magic.

* A psionic class with Cha? Maybe it would be something about "good vibes" and emotional self-control or composure against mental stress.

How should be designed a mystic character to can be showed as main character in a epic fantasy comic?

LuisCarlos17f said:

In the adventure about the shatered obelisk, and it is not a spoiler, there are goblins with psionic powers.

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By any chance are you referring to the Blue Goblin from the 3e Expanded Psionics Handbook?



War of Change by Thousand Foot Krutch. One of my favorites.

Corinnguard said:

By any chance are you referring to the Blue Goblin from the 3e Expanded Psionics Handbook?

War of Change by Thousand Foot Krutch. One of my favorites.

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No, they used regular goblins with psionic abilities.

Marandahir said:

What about Golden Sun's elemental psynergy? This gets into the important point on the TV tropes page under Anime & Manga – East Asian media often conflates spiritual power, wizardry, martial arts, and psionics into one thing because there wasn't as much of a push back against esotericism as Europeans had with the witch hunts.

But even in the West, there's tons of examples of Pyrokinesis etc as a discipline of psionics – the important point is that the elemental magic was formed by the mind and not ritual or MSV components.

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I view both power sources − Psionic and Primal − as coming from the soul. Both are strongly animistic. Both utilize the ki, spirit, and mind. But they distinguish thematically. Psionic is more human, body altering, telekinetic and dimensional, while Primal is more elemental and plant altering, wielding energies, and fabricating objects and structures.

Where "Pyrokinesis" uses the "mind" to manipulate elemental fire, this is still Primal.

Marandahir said:

This is why I think Psionics belongs as subclass archetypes across the gamut of core classes, though there should be a Psion/Mystic core class to represent Yodas & Xaviers since they're close to the Wizard concept but Wizards are crucially far too tied to their components and spellbooks and rituals to represent this power.

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I agree. A Psion class plus judicious Psionic subclasses for other classes is a great approach.

I hope the Psion is a 3e-ish fullcaster, but using a 5e Warlock chassis.

I suspect the 2e-ish Psionicist might work well as a Rogue subclass, using a skill system for Psionic instead of a spell point system.

The 5e feats already have the 1e-ish powers covered.

Marandahir said:

Monks are the easiest next step to graft psionics onto.

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2024 seems to make the Monk class more clearly Martial (without mentioning "ki"). But Monk subclasses can be Psionic.

Marandahir said:

And as we've seen with the Purple Dragon Knight playtest, there's multiple ways to make a Psionic Fighter in 5e lore, just as Eldritch Knight, Arcane Archer, Rune Knight, and Bladesinger can all coexist (as opposed to Valor Bard/Swords Bard and Pact of Blade Warlock Hexblade Patrion Warlock really being patches that are meant to supplant or enhance the other one). I could see Psion either appearing in a Rules Expansion book a la Artificer in Tasha's, or else in a book like Fizban's or Bigby's, with a few other character options that support Psionics and a bunch of Far Realm entities for your game.

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For me, Psionic is all about ones own self being the power source. So I dont see the connection with the Farrealm, except that some of them happen to be Psionic too. As aspects of thoughtscapes, Angels, Fiends, and Aberrations are all Psionic for similar reasons.

Marandahir said:

Oh and unrelateded to Yarael's post, someone said Dark Sun has been 'cancelled' – as much as I think the setting is problematic in many ways, it's also a beloved setting and part of D&D Lore and appears by name in the 2024 DMG, so it's certainly a planned setting to explore at some point. The main D&D setting that was 'cancelled' is Nerath because there's just not a lot of reason to include it if you're putting Greyhawk in the DMG and besides, you've mined Nerath for its best original stuff already (Feywild & Shadowfell, Astral Sea, Raven Queen, core Dragonborn, Tiefling, & Goliaths). Nerath struggles to fit into modern D&D because it changed so much to support the sacred cow slaughters of 4e (their words, not mine) while also borrowing from Greyhawk and Mystara wholescale for iconic setting elements. I swear, the principal reason we don't have Dark Sun yet is because they want to get Psionics right first.

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Too be honest, 5e kept the good aspects of the 4e cosmology. 5e has the salient Feywild and Shadowfell, but additionally returned the Ethereal from earlier editions, which I feel works better in the new ensemble. The shape of the 5e "circle" cosmology feels more pleasing in a jungian mandala way.

You are probably right that the delay of Dark Sun is mainly about how to do the Psion. I was surprised to see 2024 mention Dark Sun. Perhaps this indicates a more confident way forward for how to design the Psion? I prefer the 5e Psion class being in a Tashas-esque rules expansion, so it doesnt get tied too tightly to any particular setting. Several setting need the Psion class.

I miss the blue gobling subrace because it was the scum among the scum, rejected by everybody, even by the rest of members of his tribe, the ultimate pariah. The are the anti-Yoda, like if master Yoda had suffered a traumatic childhood.

Primal magic is linked to channelings the forces from the Nature and psionic is more about training the mind to reach the enlightenment and soul ascension. Primal magic is like getting an appel from the tree, and psionic is like cooking an apple cake.

I suspect psionic powers is for players who wanted something close to superheroes style like an epic fantasy version of "My hero academy".

* What if psionic factions could create their own astral domains? Deities may be not too happy about wannabe rivals. Or they could not only to visit the dream plane but also to alter it.

* The manga (anime and action-live too) "my happy wedding" shows characters with psionic powers.

* What if incorporeal spirits with psionic powers could become the "guests" of wannabi superhero?

Now I am thinking about a way to reintroduce the psionic powers. The key is a special template. It is like a normal spell but with a line for displays. This power can be casted like an ordinary spell by the spellcasters but these will need the components. The true psionic manifesters will not need components (somatic, verbal or material) at all but they will show displays, for example a light headache when somebody tries to read your thoughts. An auditive display may be dangerous because if you try to hide the rest could detect the origin of the noise.