1st ed Illusionist, bringing back the feel of in 3rd ed.

[Particle_Man]

In 1st ed AD&D, part of the charm of the
illusionist was that her spells were very
different. She had spells on her list that the Magic-User (old name for Wizard) did not
have, or had at higher levels. In addition, some spells, like Shadow Conjuration, were
much more flexible in the creatures that could be summoned.

Now, there is an illusionist in 3rd ed. But a generalist wizard would be able to cast all the
same spells at the same level, and some spells are no longer illusionist spells (like the
prismatic ones), and shadow conjuration has been changed.

I am not arguing that the 3d ed. illusionist is too weak or anything. But the style is
different. Now she is just another wizard.

Has anyone tried a 3rd ed. version of the illusionist that is closer in "Feel" to the 1st ed.
illusionist? Or is this just a pipe dream?

 

[Malin Genie]

A long while back, there was a thread about necromancers - how do you create a Necromancer that isn't just a Wizard who casts a couple of extra Necromancy spells/day and can't cast Illusions (or Enchantment, or other useless school ^_^)

My suggestion was to redesign the spell list - adding in necromantic-flavoured cleric spells, changing the levels of some of the spells, and removing manyof the 'general' wizard spells.

Unfortunately it was on the old boards and I never kept the list on my computer. But there's no reason you couldn't do the same with an illusionist 'alternate core class'. Spell list focussed heavily on illusion, some illusion spells at lower level, perhaps... Disguise as a class skill; invent unique illusion spells (or covert from 1e)

If I get really bored this weekend I might try to come up with an appropriate list.

 

[National Acrobat]

Not only are the spells important here, but so is the approach taken by the player and the GM with regards to the Illusionist. The illusionist is my favorite spellcaster, always has been. I have discovered through the years that the other problem with playing one is having a GM that understands the art of using illusion spells to achieve results. I have had some really great GM's through the years, and I have had some crappy ones that immediately have your foes find away around your spells. That being said, I agree with Malin Genie. The best way to go about it is to redefine the spell lists, or to change the schools of spells such as the Prismatics, to make them Illusions. It's really just a cosmetic approach. If you really wanted to make it like the 1E Illusionist, you just take the illusion spells away from the other wizards and give the Illusionist his own class-based spell list.

 

[Joseph Elric Smith]

I haven't but I agree with you the first edition illusionist had a much better feel then to days specialist.
ken

 

[Kweezil]

Fantasy Flight's Schools of Magic series may have what you're looking for. The first book out, Illusionism, has a new core class called the Devoted Illusionist who can cast only Illusion spells but gains a lot of bonuses with them. I haven't had a good look at it myself, but it could be a fitting successor to the 1st Ed Illusionist.

 

[Plane Sailing]

In my campaign I ditched the PHB form of specialists and created three specialist wizard types - the Elementalist, the Necromancer and, yes, the Illusionist.

They had the same spell benefits as the specialist, but each had their own unique spell list; I brought together spells from druid or cleric or Forgotten Realms settings as necessary to fill out the spell lists. If you are interested to see what I came up with, please email me.

I much prefer the idea of genuine specialists like the 1e illusionist to the tacky "schools of magic" thing which we have nowadays.

Cheers

 

[Li Shenron]

I don't have problems with the current Wizard spell list and the specialisation rules, but I agree that you can make a specialist in Illusion who prepares only 1 spell/level from the school, and the rest from e.g. Evocation; you are still called an Illusionist by the rules but you're very much something else.

I think the list is one only because they wanted to still have one single Wizard class, to make it both simple and flexible. Imagine you wanted to be a major in Illusion, with minor in Necromancy, because somehow you have found a good concept for your PC. If every mage had his own spell list, you couldn't do that, unless it was possible to multiclass Wizards of different specialization, which basically would mean like they were different classes.

I agree with you that it would be much more flavorful to have more unique abilities for specialists, and even unique spells, maybe you can design specific feats for specialists only... Personally, I think you are an Illusionist if you cast Illusions and use them as a regular strategy, doesn't matter much if by the rule you are something else (and I think the most relevant consequence of specialisation rules come from the banned school, not the favored), which means that is it totally up to the players, for good or bad.

I have more concern with the Clerics, which have a similarly too long list and a very much more serious flavorlessness: they know ALL the spells from the list.

 

[MerricB]

I posted a rough version of a "True Illusionist" based on the 1E version on my webpage:

http://www.geocities.com/merricb/dnd.htm

Cheers!

 

[Joseph Elric Smith]

I posted a rough version of a "True Illusionist" based on the 1E version on my webpage:

http://www.geocities.com/merricb/dnd.htm

Cheers!

thanks nice link
ken

 

[F5]

What about a "True Illusionist" prestige class, rather than a new core class? This would be the best of both worlds...you would have the flexibility of the single Wizard class, but you could get some of the feel of the 1E class.

I'd give it extra skill points, and make Bluff, Sense Motive, Perform (maybe others? Hide & Move SIlently?) class skills. Create a modified spell list, and say that the character continues to advance in spell level as his previous class, and keeps exising spells known, but he is can only learn new spells from this new list. You might even take some of the classic Illusionist spells (Weird, Pahntasmal Killer, etc) and remove them from the main Wizard spell list and grant them solely to the True Illusionist.

Basically, take MerricB's excellent core class as a foundation, maybe give it some prestige-ish special abilities, and call it a 10-level prestige class. Would that capture enough of the feel of the 1E illusionist?