2010: Is it Dragonlance? (hint)

[Henrix]

Draconians are a good monster on it's own, they don't need their original setting.
There are several other monsters out there that have stepped out of their settings.

I, for one, cannot understand why dragonborn were not called draconians.



I hope it'll not be Dragonlance - there is already a bland generic fantasy setting out there with Forgotten Realms. Give us something special.

 

[Lurks-no-More]

I, for one, cannot understand why dragonborn were not called draconians.

Because the draconians have been established by DL as very specific, color-coded evil creatures. They are one of the most iconic parts of that particular setting, and they don't really resemble dragonborn more than superficially.


As for Dragonlance as the next setting... eh. I like the original two trilogies, but I've not been impressed with the way the setting was handled afterwards, both in novels and in gaming products.

Furthermore, I feel that Dragonlance's greatest strength - the novels - are also its biggest weakness. Much like with Middle-Earth, you all too easily end up, or feel like you do, playing second fiddle to the "official" heroes. (Also, Ansalon is tiny. It bothers me for some reason.)

 

[Shadowsong666]

I still believe its Dragonlance. I just want it to be.

WotC will release a Dragonlance Player's Guide, Dragonlance Campaign Setting and 1 start-up adventure.
I could imagine they give SP a licence to publish 4e dragonlance stuff and so the dragonlance setting would become the most supported 4e setting.

fingers crossed

 

[Dausuul]

I'm going to disagree with this point to a degree. While Dragonlance may be based in traditional fantasy, there are enough differences to make it different from your standard vanilla setting. The setting has a very different flavor.

Every setting has its own flavor. Greyhawk has a very different flavor from Forgotten Realms has a very different flavor from Mystara. But they're still all bog-standard quasi-medieval, polytheistic settings with knights in plate and color-coded dragons and elves in the forest and dwarves in the mountains.

Dragonlance is much the same. It's got its own particular brand of quasi-medieval polytheism with knights in plate and color-coded dragons and elves in the forest and dwarves in the mountains, but when you get right down to it, it plays all the usual tropes and it plays them straight.

Compare that to Dark Sun, which is a quasi-classical atheistic setting with no knights and one Dragon and elves in the desert and dwarves in adobe huts. And cannibal halflings. That's what people mean when they say it "stands out" from traditional fantasy.

Maybe WotC is able to take that risk in 2010 with the setting book (or perhaps they can't not take the risk). DS would be a very hedged bet to take, given the amount of fan buzz on the thing, so it would make sense.

But DL is a sure bet in comparison. And given the specific publishing industry troubles and the general economic troubles, the "safe bet" would seem more likely to me.

Yeah, I have to agree, which makes me sad. I would much, much rather see Dark Sun, or something totally new; I have no interest in Dragonlance as a game setting. But I have to admit that Dragonlance is probably a smarter choice financially.

A spin-off from a popular novel series (which is what the DL setting really is) has a large guaranteed fanbase. Dark Sun's guaranteed fanbase is mostly limited to old-school gamers who remember the brief glory days of the setting from two editions back. Anything else, it'll have to build up from scratch.

Still, for what it's worth, I at least will snap up all the 4E Dark Sun material I can get my hands on; while I can't imagine buying any Dragonlance setting stuff.

 

[Henrix]

Because the draconians have been established by DL as very specific, color-coded evil creatures. They are one of the most iconic parts of that particular setting, and they don't really resemble dragonborn more than superficially.

It still seems like very minor changes to me, and most of it seems like setting specific fluff.

But dragging a race/monster from a setting and making it generic - we have seen lots of that. Thri-kreen, anyone?

 

[I'm A Banana]

FWIW, I think DL and 4e might be a pretty good fit. The problems with DL (narratives hogging the spotlight, comic relief races) are things that I think the 4e team could solve in pretty satisfying ways, without necessarily going against what DL had in 3.5. That's part of the reason I'd be willing to give it a spin: i think the 4e team can add a lot to the setting, because there's a lot of room to work that hasn't been covered in previous editions.

But dragging a race/monster from a setting and making it generic - we have seen lots of that. Thri-kreen, anyone?

Of course, 4e has an "every PC race must be a sexy humanoid" mandate, which is a rough fit with thri-krieen (unless the slap mammaries on them like they did the dragonborn ).

 

[Dragonhelm]

Bingo. The halfling has been approaching the kender ever since 3e changd them to thin, short, and quick rather than short, fat homebodies. 4e took this a step further by making them resistant to fear. Oh, but we hate kender though.... what a load of BS.

Ha ha! Yeah, the halfling in 3e and 4e has had great influence from kender. Though not exactly a clone, it's pretty close. What the kender did for halflings was to throw them right into the adventure. WotC recognized this, so they took the best of the kender, minus the so-called "baggage," and adapted that to halflings.

It's unfortunate that a few bad players and stereotypes seem to ruin the race for the non-DL gaming audience. They're really quite fun to play.

Because the draconians have been established by DL as very specific, color-coded evil creatures.

Ah, but the draconians are evolving into their own nation - Teyr. Plus, don't forget we have the noble draconians too. Draconians are no longer the evil monsters of old.

A spin-off from a popular novel series (which is what the DL setting really is)

DL originated with the games. The novels followed. That being said, the novels are what popularized the setting, so there's this misconception that the novels came first.

Dark Sun's guaranteed fanbase is mostly limited to old-school gamers who remember the brief glory days of the setting from two editions back. Anything else, it'll have to build up from scratch.

That's a good point, and something I had not thought about. I keep forgetting that there's a fair number of gamers out there who never played anything pre-3e (and now 4e). In a way, though, that might mean that Dark Sun is ripe for a re-imagining. Enough time has passed that they could do it.

But dragging a race/monster from a setting and making it generic - we have seen lots of that. Thri-kreen, anyone?

There's a misconception that they're Dark Sun-specific. Not so. So while they were made popular in Dark Sun, they actually originated in the Forgotten Realms.

It's kind of like death knights. They were around prior to Dragonlance. It's just that Dragonlance made them popular with Lord Soth.

 

[Derren]

I like DL and therefore I would not be happy if DL is the next setting. Why? just look at what WotC did to FR. I don't want the same happen to DL.

So until WOtC has proven (with Eberron) that it can 4Eize a setting without trashing it completely and that it doesn't try to "core everything" when it is not appropriate I want the next setting to be not DL.

 

[Dausuul]

DL originated with the games. The novels followed. That being said, the novels are what popularized the setting, so there's this misconception that the novels came first.

Oh, I know. The novels originated with the writers playing through the Dragonlance modules. But the novels quickly assumed control, and the setting became dependent on them. There were after all substantial differences between the plot of the modules and the plot of the novels; it was the setting that was retconned to match the novels, not the other way around.

It looks like a duck and quacks like a duck; it started out as a goose, but at this point, it is to all intents and purposes a duck.

That's a good point, and something I had not thought about. I keep forgetting that there's a fair number of gamers out there who never played anything pre-3e (and now 4e). In a way, though, that might mean that Dark Sun is ripe for a re-imagining. Enough time has passed that they could do it.

I quite agree. But it's still a gamble. Dragonlance is guaranteed to sell at least moderately well; Dark Sun could be a total flop.

 

[doctorhook]

I like DL and therefore I would not be happy if DL is the next setting. Why? just look at what WotC did to FR.

Made it fresh and interesting? Yeah, God forbid that that would happen to Dragonlance, arguably the only setting that needs it more than FR did. :rollseyes:

As I understand it, DL has done a pretty good job of trashing itself over the past few decades. WotC has a much better track record, so give credit where it's due.