D&D (2024) 2024 Player's Handbook Reveal: Feats/Backgrounds/Species

[CapnZapp]

I also don't like that Feats are mandatory now, but since every group I played with included them, it should not matter that much.

I can't get agitated over them just accepting a fait accompli.

 

[CapnZapp]

This is a tiny sidebar, but when we saw a +1 is a 5% increase is that because we think the range of any check is 1-20? But in reality the range on any check is from 0 to about 40. A +1 doesn't actually give you a 5% increase.

its because the die remains twenty sided

 

[Scribe]

This would both surprise and not surprise me.

Since we all agree that the future of everything is the subscription model, where you lose access to your stuff when you stop paying monthly, it wouldn't surprise me.

But since WotC only recently put their foot in their mouth (re OGL) I would be surprised if the executive decision was to introduce this concept now

This would be like Wizards printing proxy cards and trying to sell them at $250a pack. Oh wait...

 

[CapnZapp]

My take: It’s not game-breaking, it’s simply annoying. The game shouldn’t favor ANY combination of race-class or background-class via a mechanism that underlies the math of the entire game like stats.

The idea that players are "owed" an optimal stat spread is alien to me.

That's one reason PF2 felt constricted to me. In that game, a 1 point difference is actually impactful. (The "crit when you roll 10 over" rule definitely plays a role here).

It gives you perspective. Anyone claiming you can't play a 5E character that's a single point short of what they could have had is objectively wrong. Just go play PF2 and see what a game where this is actually true looks like. Then compare the importance in 5E and you will agree it matters far less in this game.

 

[CapnZapp]

That's not a palatable justification for anything. It's promoting a narrative that the economically disadvantaged are incapable of learning from their life experiences. That's literally one step removed from saying, "Orcs are nomads with no formal schooling, so orcs can't be as smart as sedentary people." Which, of course, is total BS.

Except of course Orcs are fictional creatures.

If a professor in Paleontology told me Neanderthals or Homo Erectus or whatever were statistically less intelligent than Homo Sapiens, I would simply take her word for it.

The same way, if Tolkien or GRRM tells me their Orcs are dummer than not only hero elves but also someone as "average" as Boromir I don't get upset, I simply say "okay".

To me, the notion different species are gifted different strengths and weakness isn't controversial.

I am not speaking for you, but for me there's nothing unpalatable or BS about it.

I actually find the notion urchins aren't as smart as nobles less palatable than fictional species A not as smart as fictional species B, so not sure the 2024 PHB is an improvement over 2014 here...

 

[TwoSix]

The idea that players are "owed" an optimal stat spread is alien to me.

That's one reason PF2 felt constricted to me. In that game, a 1 point difference is actually impactful. (The "crit when you roll 10 over" rule definitely plays a role here).

It gives you perspective. Anyone claiming you can't play a 5E character that's a single point short of what they could have had is objectively wrong. Just go play PF2 and see what a game where this is actually true looks like. Then compare the importance in 5E and you will agree it matters far less in this game.

I agree it doesn’t matter much. But I want it anyway.

All aesthetic preferences are irrational at their core. I can still pick the games that cater to my preferences and eschew others, even if they aren’t objectively wrong.

 

[CapnZapp]

What gets me about it is that it's completely an unforced error. No one was clamoring for stat boosts to be attached to the backgrounds.

Just leave the Tasha's status quo, have the stat boosts as a purely game mechanical step unattached to any narrative, and no one would be complaining about anything.

Except now you're ignoring all those who complained about losing race bonuses?

Why are you presenting your preferred outcome as the least controversial outcome?

 

[TwoSix]

Except now you're ignoring all those who complained about losing race bonuses?

Why are you presenting your preferred outcome as the least controversial outcome?

Because it's my belief that keeping race and background as primarily aesthetic considerations, with a light touch of mechanical grounding, would be the most acceptable situation to the broadest swathe of the 5e player base.

Like any of us, all I can offer is anecdote and a general feel of the zeitgeist based on years of reading various online sources.

I used the phrase "No one" as, of course, just a bit of flavorful hyperbole. Quite a few of my posts aren't actually particularly serious.

 

[Scott Christian]

I quite liked the idea you had to play an Elf (or whatever) to reach the very top echelons of Intelligence.

Allowing characters of every race to be equally good at everything means something got lost, in my opinion.

Yeah, I get it. There are really two sides:

- One that does not mind limitations built into character design based on choices.
or
- One that believes that no limitations should exist in character design based on choices.

One is willing to have lower abilities in return for something more unique. To some of them, it helps create the trop effect, which they feel is important for world building. For others, it helps them focus on other parts of the character, not just the class focus.

or

One is not willing to compromise their character's abilities due to choices they make. To some of them, there is a level of equality, and the belief that everyone at the table should be equal (especially two characters who made the same choices). For others, it is a way to gain the system (which can be fun), and min/max/optimize better than others.

 

[Zeromaru X]

That's the way Dragonborn have been depicted in books since the change in art direction after the Forgotten Realms Magic set...so after BG3.

Perhaps, but people has been playing BG3 ever since, so these head types have become a reference for those who main dragonborn. And given that they took the time to change the head types of true dragons... Well. Instead, they chose the unspired path...

But perhaps it's just me, as I find 5e24 art just plain boring. All "species" are now humans in cosplay.