D&D 5E 3/4 Caster: Its Absence and Design Space in 5E

[Minigiant]

If your players are willing to take spells in order to nope out of the campaign it says more about the GM's lack of awareness than the spells themselves. "find your way home" is simply not a suitable challenge for a party of level 11-20 PCs. The other spells you list still boil down to the lack of slot progression and the need to have the right one prepared at the right time when the right situation comes up. Actual gameplay just doesn't play out like the contrived forewarned with PC's built to suit whiteroom situations wotc overweighs for so much of high level 5e.

That's the point.

6th through 9th spells invalidate whole types of quests and campaigns. Whole sets of major obstacles and conditionsare stripped away one by one.

1st and 2nd level spells are basically "normal" items, goods,and services but faster, no cost, or no failure or next era technology

Grease, Charm Person, Shield, knock, Spider climb,

3rd-5th level spells are minor miracles and lesser reality warping with restrictions

Gaseous Form, Tongues, Control Water, Polymorph, Scrying,

6th level spells and above is bending reality to your will with only the spells slot and material costs being your chains

The point is not that the DM/GM is allowing the 11th+ level fullcaster to mess up the game, its that 5e designed the 11th+ level fullcaster to cut out some obstacles and threats. That's why you only get 1 of each. That's why class feature that recharge spells are limited to 5th and below. It is intentional tier based design.

That problem for 3/4th and 2/3 casters is that within 6th-9th level spells, there is no rhyme or reason. It's not 6th and 7th level are quest breakers but 8th and 9th are campaign breakers. Spells are all over the place in power because legacy.

Without intential design within the "big magic", there is no reason toi ntentionally design a 3/4th or 2/3rd caster. You'd be creating something without a purpose.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

You know what, @Steampunkette ? I don't care anymore. I have better things to do than to argue with someone who needs to be right.

Mod Note: Disengagement from another poster is fine, but it’s preferable not to deliver a parting shot.

 

[MichaelSomething]

Take 15 levels of a full spell casting class and 5 levels in a non spell class; done.

 

[tetrasodium]

That's the point.

6th through 9th spells invalidate whole types of quests and campaigns. Whole sets of major obstacles and conditionsare stripped away one by one.

1st and 2nd level spells are basically "normal" items, goods,and services but faster, no cost, or no failure or next era technology

Grease, Charm Person, Shield, knock, Spider climb,

3rd-5th level spells are minor miracles and lesser reality warping with restrictions

Gaseous Form, Tongues, Control Water, Polymorph, Scrying,

6th level spells and above is bending reality to your will with only the spells slot and material costs being your chains

The point is not that the DM/GM is allowing the 11th+ level fullcaster to mess up the game, its that 5e designed the 11th+ level fullcaster to cut out some obstacles and threats. That's why you only get 1 of each. That's why class feature that recharge spells are limited to 5th and below. It is intentional tier based design.

That problem for 3/4th and 2/3 casters is that within 6th-9th level spells, there is no rhyme or reason. It's not 6th and 7th level are quest breakers but 8th and 9th are campaign breakers. Spells are all over the place in power because legacy.

Without intential design within the "big magic", there is no reason toi ntentionally design a 3/4th or 2/3rd caster. You'd be creating something without a purpose.

Good berry create food &water tiny hut so on and so forth. The "problem" you are concerned about begins much earlier than 6th level spells. 5e is just badly designed when it comes to certain classes of spells, thsts not a reason that supports freezing caster slot gain progression around ten after continually slowing it starting at level 3 7 9 &11. As to purpose of how these other fractional casters would function and the design problems in 5e that would need to be addressed in the process, I've already covered that in detail and even provided a handy graphic.

 

[MoonSong]

And then people apparently hated on them SO MUCH in just the first survey that WotC scrapped them both entirely and never even attempted to show new versions until after the public playtest ended.

No, people didn't hated them. At least not most people. The problem wasn't playtest sorcerer and warlock not being beloved -heck a bit over the top, but the playtest sorcerer reflected a lot of what was cool about sorcerers-, the problem was wizard players demanding spell points and whining about how unfair was to have a full caster able to wear full plate. Basically because anything but a gimped sorcerer -which we ended up having- is oppressive to wizard players and nobody can have cool toys without the wizard taking them away.