D&D 3E/3.5 [3.5] Alter Self

[Chris_Nightwing]

This has been a most inspiring and impressive thread!

One thing I would like to point out is that (I think) 2e Alter Self allowed you to get wings, but they were inert and useless.

On another point, can you not indeed use Savage Species or similar to extrapolate and change into, say, a young ogre? As long as you stick to the base HD limit isn't that ok?

Also, for the ultimate disguise (and to cause confusion), turn yourself into a child - no stat changes, no skill penalties (perhaps on certain ones I would rule as a DM, intimidate springs to mind).

 

[Ferret]

You guys aren't even seeing the big picture are you? Half dragons!

You can become a young black dragon! And all other kinds of stuff! What about the drakes?

 

[Chris_Nightwing]

No templates, for the (n+1)th time!

 

[Darklone]

No templates, for the (n+1)th time!

If he's a halfdragon, then his race is draconian... he does not want to change into a halfdragon with the spell, he's talking about the application of the spell by a halfdragon.

 

[Conaill]

One thing I would like to point out is that (I think) 2e Alter Self allowed you to get wings, but they were inert and useless.

Nope. That would be Change Self, not Alter Self. AS could give you wings with a fly speed of 30' and poor maneuverability.

On another point, can you not indeed use Savage Species or similar to extrapolate and change into, say, a young ogre? As long as you stick to the base HD limit isn't that ok?

Except that an Ogre is of type Giant, not Humanoid. In fact there aren't *any* Large or larger Humanoids in the MM, except for some lycanthropes, which don't qualify because they use a template. (There don't seem to be any > 5 HD Humanoids either, for that matter.) Personally, I think Giants should be classified as Huge Humanoid (Giant), but hey...

As for changing into something with less racial HD, I asked about that earlier and got shot down. Presumably because of the part that says "You are effectively disguised as an average member of the new form's race."

Then again, as you point out, changing age presumably *is* within the scope of the spell, so alower-HD version of a standard creature could be argued to be within its scope as well. One of those things you'll just have to negotiate with your DM.

 

[LokiDR]

You guys aren't even seeing the big picture are you? Half dragons!

You can become a young black dragon! And all other kinds of stuff! What about the drakes?

Other than flight, I don't think you can get all that much out of a 5hd or less dragon.

 

[Number47]

If we assume any possible caster, are there any really abusable uses of this spell? You know, if the caster is an abberation, or a monstrous humanoid?

 

[LokiDR]

Forest Gnome small (+1 bonus to Armor Class, +1 bonus on attack rolls, +4 bonus on Hide checks), 20ft move,+4 hide (+8 in wooded areas)

A side question really, but is that +4 stackable with the racial +4? Forest Gnomes might well be an utterly amazing shape for hiding. Wand of alter self for a rogue?

 

[Wippit Guud]

It stacks... one is a size bonus, one is a racial bonus. Goblins get the same thing

 

[LokiDR]

If we assume any possible caster, are there any really abusable uses of this spell? You know, if the caster is an abberation, or a monstrous humanoid?

I posted some monsterous humanoids out of MMII that could provide a lot of utility. I don't see that as any more powerful than outsiders. There are more ways to be an outsider than a monsterous humanoid.