D&D 4E 4E in 2008? Fact or Fiction?

[Mercule]

See, I don't get that.

If you said "The sooner 4e comes out, the sooner I can stop buying new books," that I could understand. I might well disagree, based on the quality and nature of the new game, but I could understand.

But the notion of retiring the hobby because you don't like the latest edition, that I just don't get. Nothing they put out in the future changes what you've already got in your books. Giving up something that you're enjoying* because of a new edition isn't jaded. It's just, well, silly.

I dropped 2E because I got sick of the crap TSR was doing. Granted, I wasn't enjoying the game as much, either. More, though, there was an attitude of not being willing to give any more money to such a foul-acting corporation, and that included the money anyone I taught to play would end up paying for new books -- or the money I'd have to throw down to stay current enough to have a game the newbies could buy into. My group was a lot more fluid at the time, though, so it might not be an issue today.

Regardless, that's how I got into WoD -- and how I finally got my group to try anything besides D&D, since the only other regular DM got fed up at the same time as me.

 

[Ranger REG]

But the notion of retiring the hobby because you don't like the latest edition, that I just don't get. Nothing they put out in the future changes what you've already got in your books. Giving up something that you're enjoying* because of a new edition isn't jaded. It's just, well, silly.

Silly to you, perhaps. But as much as I love my first love of RPG, I don't think I can afford to keep at this hobby. This pen-n-paper game is the reason why I rarely buy computer games like Final Fantasy. (What version is out now on? 10? 11?)

I want to milk the Third Edition for all it's worth, which is why I'm not looking forward to 4e just yet. But I'm not young as those who are calling out for 4e, whose income are more disposable than my hair on my head.

So, I don't see the need for yet another rules revision or rules overhaul. If WotC want to correct the rules, they should just put out errata. They want to field-test new rules options, release Unearthed Arcana II.

Silly? Maybe, but ultimately it's my decision.

 

[Ranger REG]

Regardless, that's how I got into WoD -- and how I finally got my group to try anything besides D&D, since the only other regular DM got fed up at the same time as me.

How'd you like the new World of Darkness line?

 

[Ranger REG]

Quick hypotheticals here, then...

First case -- suppose WotC released "Ranger REG's version of the perfect quasi-medeival fantasy RPG" tomorrow, for a reasonable price (in your opinion), with your version of the perfect licensing terms for third parties. Would you buy it?

What would be better than 3.5e?

P.S. I know, I'm beginning to sound like diaglo.

 

[ColonelHardisson]

I want to milk the Third Edition for all it's worth, which is why I'm not looking forward to 4e just yet. But I'm not young as those who are calling out for 4e, whose income are more disposable than my hair on my head.

So, I don't see the need for yet another rules revision or rules overhaul. If WotC want to correct the rules, they should just put out errata. They want to field-test new rules options, release Unearthed Arcana II.

Silly? Maybe, but ultimately it's my decision.

Getting older does cast a different light on the matter. I'm 39, and my income is much less disposable than before, and finding a group of people who play that are roughly in my age range is tough. Still, I am for a 4th edition, especially if that 4th edition doesn't muck about too much with the basic system beyond incorporating rules revisions that came about due to extensive field testing by D&D players, and including a lot of the coolest material from the splat books (like the Warlock) in the core rules. Mainly, I'd like to see a lot of elements (rules, monsters, etc.) that are now scattered about in splat books, Dragon and Dungeon magazines, and WotC's website, drawn together into a more convenient form. Also, it'd be nice to see WotC actually produce a computer program along the lines of what eTools started out to be long ago, and have it available when the new edition is released.

 

[Mouseferatu]

Silly to you, perhaps. But as much as I love my first love of RPG, I don't think I can afford to keep at this hobby. This pen-n-paper game is the reason why I rarely buy computer games like Final Fantasy. (What version is out now on? 10? 11?)

I want to milk the Third Edition for all it's worth, which is why I'm not looking forward to 4e just yet. But I'm not young as those who are calling out for 4e, whose income are more disposable than my hair on my head.

So, I don't see the need for yet another rules revision or rules overhaul. If WotC want to correct the rules, they should just put out errata. They want to field-test new rules options, release Unearthed Arcana II.

Silly? Maybe, but ultimately it's my decision.

But again, what you're talking about is simply not buying new stuff. Maybe we're just using the word differently, but to me, "retiring the hobby" sounds like giving up any use of the stuff you already have. I'm still just not seeing why one necessitates the other.

I just don't buy the notion that people have to buy new stuff to keep up. I didn't buy very much new D&D material during the latter several years of 2E. I skipped the entire Players Options series, and I was still playing frequently and regularly straight through into 3E.

So when I say I don't "get" your reasoning, that's not me trying to be rude or snarky. I truly don't comprehend it.

 

[BonesMcCoy]

Also, it'd be nice to see WotC actually produce a computer program along the lines of what eTools started out to be long ago, and have it available when the new edition is released.

This is an excellent point. I also think they should work very hard to make the 4e DMG the best it could possibly be. I'd particularly like to see more attention paid to helping DMs create their own worlds, including gods and planes.

 

[Ranger REG]

But again, what you're talking about is simply not buying new stuff. Maybe we're just using the word differently, but to me, "retiring the hobby" sounds like giving up any use of the stuff you already have. I'm still just not seeing why one necessitates the other.

I just don't buy the notion that people have to buy new stuff to keep up. I didn't buy very much new D&D material during the latter several years of 2E. I skipped the entire Players Options series, and I was still playing frequently and regularly straight through into 3E.

But did you eventually bought the new PHB (3.5e) to replace your 3.0e? I delayed purchasing until recently. You see I don't mind new supplements because that's what they are: non-essentials that I can choose to buy optionally. But buying new core rules in so short a time?

So when I say I don't "get" your reasoning, that's not me trying to be rude or snarky. I truly don't comprehend it.

I know you're not trying to be rude. I see from an outsider's perspective that it is silly. I guess at my age I can afford to be.

 

[Jhamin]

The thing of it is 4th editon will come out when the 3.5 books stop selling well enough. Not before.

If you need an example, 3.5 came out because the 3.0 books had stopped selling well enough.

Lots of folks get to a place with D&D where they decide that they have what they want to keep playing. At that point they stop buying new books. This has happened with each and every version of the game. (How many people talk about skipping the players options books from 2nd, or the splats from 3.0?). Once the new books stop selling it doesn't make sense to keep making more. At that point the company either has to stop making D&D or it has to make a new edition.

As for all the people who are upset because their collection for books from the old edition are now out dated? They don't matter. They weren't buying books anyway. And the few players who did keep buying an unprofitable game by definition weren't buying enough to keep things profitable. A game that everyone loves but no one buys won't pay any publisher's bills. Better to upset some fans to get others to start buying again.

There are old die-hards who refuse to play anything other than 1st editon. The company that makes D&D hasn't made any money off them since the eighties. They are not a part of current marketing plans. If there are 3.x players who refuse to update to 4th, they will become part of the same subculture.
I respect and admire people who find their system and stick with it. (Heck, I was a Champions/Hero player during the Cybergames era) but you can't expect the publishers to obsess over them.

So as long as we all keep buying 3.5, it will continue to be made.




Of course, I'm skipping the environment books.......

 

[Ranger REG]

The thing of it is 4th editon will come out when the 3.5 books stop selling well enough. Not before.

If you need an example, 3.5 came out because the 3.0 books had stopped selling well enough.

Ehhh...

See, I really don't buy those statements. :\