D&D 4E [4E Players, mainly] Ever thought of defecting to Pathfinder?

[OnlineDM]

This thread helps me understand the phenomenon of edition wars (which confuse me in general, probably because I've only been playing D&D for about a year). It sounds like it's largely about people's feelings toward the companies that make the same more than it's about the content of the games themselves.

It sounds like the OP is saying, "I like 4e as a game, but I don't really like WotC as a company. They make 4e, so it's hard for me to support them by continuing to play 4e. Therefore, I'm considering a switch to Pathfinder. I don't think I'll like the game as much, but I think I'll like the company a lot more and will feel better about giving my money to them, so it might be worth the switch for me."

Some people might say, "I feel that way too." Other people might say, "I feel differently," either because they don't care about the company that makes their game, or because they don't have negative feelings toward WotC / positive feelings toward Paizo. But seeing these feelings spelled out helps someone like me understand some portion of the emotion around edition wars. For that, I'm glad for this post - I feel like I understand some people's views on the issue better now.

And yes, I do understand that it's sometimes completely about the mechanics that people prefer or don't prefer and the emotional connection that people feel to their preferred version of a game. But this feeling toward the companies is something I hadn't understood very well until now.

 

[Incenjucar]

I won't stop playing 4E until something better for me comes along, or until there's nobody to play with (being in Seattle, that can't happen) - I don't feel that Pathfinder is better for me. I most certainly vote with my wallet - I have only purchased books that I have desired to, and only subscribed to DDI until they stopped producing what I want. Because I don't care for the Essentials line, I haven't bought nearly as much lately, so I've been spending my money on miniatures and painting supplies instead. All my books and the offline CB and the magazines I have are still 100% functional, and the game still works fine, so I can keep on playing until the day I die - 4E's rules are damned good. While I enjoy reading new content, I'm not addicted to it - I make my own already.

In the true core three products alone, there are more possibilities than I will ever need to make use of. Combine this with my large library of 4E, 3E, and 2E material, the internet, and my imagination, and new purchases are almost silly to begin with.

I could only see "defecting" to Pathfinder if I had some sort of content addiction which required me to constantly pay money to SOMEONE to get my game on, or if Pathfinder became, for me, better than 4E.

 

[caudor]

I hate to admit this, but here it goes. I'll try to be brief.

I've played D&D since 1981.

I've been happy about every new edition from 1e-4e. Yes, I think 4e made huge improvements to D&D, especially for DMs. You could say I'm too easy to please; I accepted each version of D&D with excitment and expectation of something better.

I've never played any role-playing game except D&D. I eye-balled some, but never seriously looked since D&D filled my needs.

I think the first inkling that something was 'odd' about WotC is when they pulled the digital offerings from the market. I had invested heavily in pdfs from all editions. I'm talking hundreds of dollars. OK, I decided, D&D is pen and table game for now and I moved on.

I don't know if it occured before or after, but when they cancelled the hardcopy versions of Dungeons and Dragon mags, I was concerned again. Oh, now they are going digital. OK, and I moved on.

--Skipping over many little disconcerting events--

Then the sudden change on the character builder. Then the big silence. Then, the recent cancellation of three books. Not a big deal, right? But for me, something was feeling very wrong after the book cancellations. WotC's pattern of thrashing about became clear to me. What the heck is going on? For the first time, I was worried about what was to become of D&D.

Yesterday, for the first time ever, I went online to see what this Pathfinder was all about. I read about, considered it, but in the end decided to stick with 4e because I remember how hard it was DMing 3e.

The point is: I looked. I pondered. I considered something other than D&D.

I'm not sure what set off my spidy-senses. Of course, I'm not sure what is going on with WotC, at all.

 

[Njall]

Why would I? 4e is still there even if WotC stops producing it.
I've got my offline CB, my dead tree books and my group, why would I switch to something else?
Even if I disliked some of WotC's business decisions, lately ( so much that I stopped being a regular DDI subscriber ), it's no reason to stop playing a game I like and that works perfectly for me: they're a business, they're not my girlfriend, they don't owe me a thing; if they put out stuff I don't like I'll just vote with my wallet and not buy it.
Aside from that, I'll gladly play in a Pathfinder/3.5 game as long as someone else runs them, just like I've done in the last 3 years.

 

[Mr. Wilson]

I've played many, many different RPGs throughout the course of my life; more than some, less than others.

4E has some of the best core fantasy mechanics that I've played, though there are little things I do wish were different (like every other game out there I've ever tried).

I've played Pathfinder before, but found it to be just another version of 3.X. I enjoyed 3.X the entire time I played it (much more than I did AD&D), but going back to it now would be the equivalent of playing the SNES when I could be playing my PS3.

It may be fun in short (very short) bursts, but not for an every week game.

 

[Goonalan]

I keep looking at PF, I even bought some of the early APs and then some of the settings stuff, and the books are lush and vibrant and full of... They just read better, and have depth and character and make more sense- as a narrative.

And then I remember to use all this great stuff I have to go back to my old ways, I have to DM a 3/.5rd edition style game again- I can't do it.

My game is better now (4e) because I have the time to do other things, like inject the story and RP, and be ready for the players, previously I was too busy trying to keep together the wedge of paper/notes et al I needed to make to just play.

I love their stuff, dislike their game.

I wish WOTC had the PF style.

Cheers Goonalan

 

[UngeheuerLich]

What Aegerli said!

The best thing to do is buy WotC Produkts, if we want to havethem make better decisions. (Decisions we like.)

But lets be honest, what we few people do here does not matter at all. They need to get back casual players, and they need to make better executable plan.

It is not their intend, that is problematic, but their execution. They have good support, no question. We are demanding a lot of them actually. But often they do things that don´t happen smooth.

Maybe a better decision for them would have been releasing the CB earlier, and when it is ready, release all essential books at once, so that a new customer feels confident.

I am more or less content. I have seen much more promises and worse execution.

(Heroes 5 e.g.)

 

[ProfessorCirno]

Play and enjoy both, reap all the benefits.

Alternately, play what you like, regardless of business or politics going on in the companies.

Alternately alternately, grab the mechanics you like from whatever and the fluff from whatever and combine the two.

I guess what I'm saying is, neither edition "loyalty" nor the state of WotC's business should decide what games you play. What you enjoy should. And if I really enjoyed 4e and really unenjoyed 3e, I'd see no reason whatsoever to move back.

 

[Bluenose]

Pathfinder is pretty much everything I hated about 3.5 but repackaged, so I have no interest in it whatsoever and so it is literally the last thing I would ever want to play. If Wizards does drop the ball with 4E I will either wait and see how another 4E-like replacement goes (5th edition?), or just play 4E until I eventually decide to move on (or I can't find anyone who wants to play 4E). It is most likely I will go back to playing Call of Cthulhu for my tabletop fix, which has always been my RPG of choice when I haven't been playing DnD. It's a testament to 4E and how much I do enjoy it that I am not running any Call of Cthulhu right now.

I think I'd put Pathfinder a little ahead of FATAL or RaHoWa.

Of course, I'd pick Runequest ahead of CoC too.

 

[schekker]

I am pretty much in the same boat as the original poster.
I played AD&D in my younger years and this year started playing D&D again with my kids. I choose 4th edition and like the system.

When Essentials came out I looked at it and liked what I saw, so most characters were transferred to Essentials ones. I also saw that Essentials screamed for future expansion books.

I know there is a lot of speculation about the recent WotC announcements, but for my the conclusion is simple: They've stopped development of the Essentials line.

As we want to start a new campaign after our current module is finished I am indeed left with the question what to do?

Do I go with the Essential line, even though it has quite some stuff missing (basically the stuff in the cancelled books). Do I go back to the original 4 edition line and use that. Or is it time to switch?

One additional reason for me to switch would be the availability of good modules. WotC hardly has any and from what I have read they are not really interested in it either. Third party support for 4e is lackluster at best, and from what I read with good reason. Problem with Pathfinder, as far as I can tell, is that as a system it will be less to my tastes.

So yes, I am at least looking at other options, although I haven't made up my mind yet.