D&D 4E 4E sceptics - what do you like?

[Toras]

I find myself the closest thing to a 4e advocate in my group, in that I am merely extremely skeptical as opposed to uncaring or antipathic. I don't like a large number of the chances, fluff and crunch both, since this is a positive thread let me make with the positive.

Many of the basic ideas that went into 4e are ones I can support.
1) Reduced "christmas tree" and magic item dependency.
2) A unified progression for base attack bonus/defense, with class abilities modifying is another good one.
3) A unified and simplified monster design mechanic is also a good idea.
4) Action Points (I like them in Grim Tales, M&M,...the list goes on)
5) Empty Chamber problem for wizards
6) Level drain can be a pain.
7) Consolidating the Skill system
8) Fighters being more interesting.
9) Certain Class Balance efforts.

Of course, I like exactly none of the implementations of these, but the concepts are solid in and of themselves. So I suppose they get points for trying.

 

[CleverNickName]

I too am a fan of its folded skills. 3.X just had too many of 'em...too much paperwork.

 

[Geron Raveneye]

Just wanted to throw a quick "Thanks" inbetween into the thread for all the answers and for keeping the thread on track.

 

[Lizard]

I find it interesting that some people's likes are my biggest peeves, and some people's deal-killers are either neutral or positive to me. (Not saying which since I don't want to derail the thread into the same nitpicking every other thread has...)

Other likes -- these have been mentioned by others, but I wanted to add them to my list:

More 'cool' magic items, ala MIC, fewer '+2 Dex, +2 Str' items.

The Feywild, the Astral Sea, etc. I never use official fluff, but now, the official fluff looks a LOT like my homebrew fluff, making it easier to adapt material.

Eladrin -- to me, elves should be badasses in shimmering mithral plate wielding glowing magic longswords and kicking orc butt, not namby-pamby tree hugging hippies.

Bloodied: It's a crack in the wall of 'perfectly functional from 100 hit points to 1, then dead', which is one of the most sacred of cows in D&D. I also like the idea of both positive and negative effects occuring on Bloodied.

Static HP: This is minor, since I've been using it since 3.0 came out, but it's nice to be 'official'. Point-based chargen ditto.

Increased use of synergies in attacks: I like it when the players need to really play as a team to win, instead of everyone spamming their biggest attack and the cleric just watching health bars. (Which is why I prefer original EQ combat to WoW combat..in EQ, you really had to know your class well. In WoW, other than maybe in instances, a PUG can clean out a dungeon without barely a moment to rest. But that's another thread...)

 

[Aus_Snow]

I like what I've heard, re: fewer magic items, and/or making them 'mean more'. This can only be good, as far as I'm concerned. I'll be waiting to see whether that's true, and if so, how true. Still, it sounds positive.

 

[amethal]

Likes :-

Downgrading the importance of magic items

The new monster design rules, especially since there are apparently detailed guidelines about what a 4th level brute etc. should look like

Reducing the number of skills (although hardly justifies a new edition!)

Points of light

Racial abilities which are important throughout a character's career

The drop in price of 3rd edition books on amazon and ebay

 

[Geron Raveneye]

Right, one more to the list See, the longer the thread runs, the more positive points 4E can actually accumulate in my mind.

- The lessening of the whole buffing race with items. I love interesting magical gadgets and artifacts, but all those stat/save/skill booster items that cropped up like mushroom patches in an Underdark dungeon went boring pretty fast. I actually prefer making the heroes get by on their own powers.