4E- Starting to win me over

[The Little Raven]

As for the craft rules: I'd say roll an INT Check.

This was what I hated about 3e's Craft rules... all crafters (regardless of the actual capabilities required to perform the trade) had to be smart. Doesn't matter if you're strong (like a smith needs to be) or good with your hands (like a woodcarver needs to be) or patient (like a glassblower needs to be)... just matters that you have a solid IQ. That's why the crafting system I wrote up for one of my players uses the Ritual system for it's basic format, but uses ability checks for the different crafts (Strength for Blacksmith, for example).

 

[Twowolves]

This was what I hated about 3e's Craft rules... all crafters (regardless of the actual capabilities required to perform the trade) had to be smart.

You don't have to be smart at all, really. INT mod is just a bonus, and a nearly insignificant one at that. Consider: most tradesmen are experts (with a lot of skill points to burn), so max ranks in your craft skill (level+3) with a skill focus in your area of expertise (+3) using some good tools (masterwork tools +2). So with a bog-standard 10 Int, you have around level+8 in your stock and trade. Throw in an apprentice (Aid another +2) and your first level, average Int blacksmith has a +11 to his Craft checks, quite good enough to make Masterwork items by taking 10.

As a tangent, I saw a show on the making of real katanas. The little old japanese guys making them looked frail and ancient, using a device to do the hammering part of the work. I'd certainly say that smith didn't have a huge strength score, but was probably pretty smart.

 

[Pbartender]

This was what I hated about 3e's Craft rules... all crafters (regardless of the actual capabilities required to perform the trade) had to be smart. Doesn't matter if you're strong (like a smith needs to be) or good with your hands (like a woodcarver needs to be) or patient (like a glassblower needs to be)... just matters that you have a solid IQ. That's why the crafting system I wrote up for one of my players uses the Ritual system for it's basic format, but uses ability checks for the different crafts (Strength for Blacksmith, for example).

Right. In 4E, it might be more appropriate to say something like, "Make an Intelligence or Dexterity check, which ever you prefer. If you have a back ground working with leather or weapons, add a +5 bonus. If you have access to a decent set of tools for working leather, add another +2. It'll take about 5 minutes, or one short rest, to make the repairs."

 

[Fifth Element]

My previous experiences with it have been limited to a trial run of 4E combat with some friends and minimal story, several delve events at Origins, and a D&D tournament game at Origins. None of these were overly fun for me.

The game tonight finally felt like D&D again.

Good post. I will just say that for any previous edition of D&D, if all I had experience with it were trial combats, "delve"-style and tournament games, they wouldn't feel like D&D to me either.

 

[Scribble]

Right. In 4E, it might be more appropriate to say something like, "Make an Intelligence or Dexterity check, which ever you prefer. If you have a back ground working with leather or weapons, add a +5 bonus. If you have access to a decent set of tools for working leather, add another +2. It'll take about 5 minutes, or one short rest, to make the repairs."

Yeah that's pretty much how I'd go too. I just boiled it down to an INT check to be quick. (not knowing anything about said PC's background n' all.)

 

[exile]

You'll all be happy to know that my halfling ranger was able to make due with a sling captured from a kobold slinger until she was able to get back to town to purchase a new one (she didn't trust shoddy kobold workmanship anymore than her own misaligned sling). Unfortunately, a failed skill challenge resulted in her and the rest of the party paying double the list cost for the sling and other provisions needed for their nest expedition.

The group was later joined by a couple of barbarians (actually a human warlord and human wizard, both with norse trappings) and an elven paladin (all of these were new PCs by the way). Ownership of the dirty, itchy halfling NPC passed between the PC halflings and the barbarians multiple times, but the little bugger is still alive and plaguing us all...only now he's armed.

Story aside, the second session of the new 4E campaign went almost as well as the first. The role-playing was again lots of fun. We only had one combat and it was far too easy for a group of our size (taking out a sole sentry left by a rival adventuring group to guard the entrance to an abandoned mint). Sadly, we had to disperse for the evening before anymore mayhem could ensue.

Overall, I'm still digging 4E. As my DM says, "it's growing on us...like a fungus." I'm especially looking forward to playing in some Living FR events at Gen Con (as well as the Pathfinder Society events). I'm eager to see if one provides more consistently enjoyable game play than the other, but remain fully cognizant that that enjoyment will hinge more on individual DMs and players than anything else.

By the way, thanks for all the advice on how to handle the repair of the sling. My halfling is actually more shepherdess than leatherworker, so she didn't even bother trying to repair the sling as others were readily available (see above).

Chad

 

[Ycore Rixle]

My first impressions of playing 4e were similar: "This still plays like D&D." I was surprised that I got that feeling more outside of combat than inside. Combat's a little different, but the rest of it feels pretty similar.