4th level spell + 1 wildshape = what fly effect?

[Magus Coeruleus]

Hi there,

I am looking for some opinions on what would be an appropriate effect for a 4th level spell that, as a swift action, lets you expend one of your wildshape uses that round to gain the ability to fly without actually turning into a bird or other flying animal. I think that it should be good enough to give you an Overland Flight effect, since it's a 4th level spell + wildshape to give you the equivalent of a 5th level spell. Does this seem fair, too stingy, or too generous? If so what would you suggest as a way of toning down or further improving the effect? Of course even if it seems fair just as is it could have benefits and drawbacks to differ slightly from Overland Flight while balancing out to the same usefulness. For instance, maybe you'd actually sprout wings which could be a hindrance of some sort but you could do a diving charge (like a falcon) faster than double speed, maybe for extra damage as a diving charge.

Thanks for your help!

 

[Jack Simth]

The biggest issue is that any such spell has entered power-creep territory.

Granted, a medium or smaller Druid-4 can Fly full-time in an Ex fasion just by taking max ranks in Ride, and at least five ranks in Handle Animal (for the Synergy, but also for the training, see last7), the purchase of an exotic saddle, and selecting the alternate Dire Bat animal companion.

But the Dire Bat is large, and can't follow the Druid into every dungeon until the Druid has access to 4th level spells - for Reduce Animal. Even then, it takes a Small druid to ride a Dire bat when the Dire Bat is Reduced.

Druids are already one of the stronger classes - with a bit of work, they can be meleer's or blasters or healers. Often all three on the same day.

Hmm... rambling. Oh well.

 

[zlorf]

fly effect

I would lean toward average flight, its not to powerful, they would need some feats like hover etc to be really useful in combat. It would be good enough to fly out of trouble or just to get a birdseye view. I guess you would limit flying to a number of rounds, or maybe use fatigue rules based on CON.

Good fight or better would be too good

regards
Z

Hi there,

I am looking for some opinions on what would be an appropriate effect for a 4th level spell that, as a swift action, lets you expend one of your wildshape uses that round to gain the ability to fly without actually turning into a bird or other flying animal. I think that it should be good enough to give you an Overland Flight effect, since it's a 4th level spell + wildshape to give you the equivalent of a 5th level spell. Does this seem fair, too stingy, or too generous? If so what would you suggest as a way of toning down or further improving the effect? Of course even if it seems fair just as is it could have benefits and drawbacks to differ slightly from Overland Flight while balancing out to the same usefulness. For instance, maybe you'd actually sprout wings which could be a hindrance of some sort but you could do a diving charge (like a falcon) faster than double speed, maybe for extra damage as a diving charge.

Thanks for your help!

 

[Machiavelli]

My gut reaction: if you want to limit combat usefulness for a flying druid, go with Poor or Clumsy; it's what I gave to my Elymasti race, after looking very carefully at the available options.

Using flight-related feats from Races of the Wild, Complete Adventurer, and other sources, you can put together a VERY potent dive package. Anything above Clumsy can dive pretty dang well, using the feats and the dive to deal nasty damage. The real limit behind the maneuverability is how long it takes to set up for a second dive.
If all you want to do with flight is get over/around obstacles, even Clumsy flight will work. If you simply wish to have a safe vantage point from which to cast spells or fire arrows, the Hover feat can be applied to any maneuverability for that effect.

For a 4th-level spell and a wildshape, depending upon the duration of the effect, I'd even grant Perfect manuverability. For 1 round/level, definitely Perfect with a 10-round cap, Good without the cap. For multiple minutes, Perhaps limit it to Average. For hours, Poor.