D&D (2024) 5.5/6e - Is it time for Wounds/Vitality?

DND_Reborn

The High Aldwin
I don't think you could do W/VP as an optional variant for D&D. There is way too much it impacts IMO and would need to be baked into the system like in d20 SW.
 

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Blue

Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal
I think HPs is one of the sacred cows of D&D that they won't get rid of. So regardless of the viability or superiority of Wounds/Vitality, I am rahter sure it will not make an appearance in the 2024 books. It has nothing to do with the system, that is irrelevant to why I don't think we will see it,
 

Stalker0

Legend
I don't think you could do W/VP as an optional variant for D&D. There is way too much it impacts IMO and would need to be baked into the system like in d20 SW.
If you went with the simplest version of it, the only thing it would change is that PCs and Monsters would all have a W and a VP number..... that's it. Heck for monsters you could just leave them at wounds only if you wanted, since it would rarely have an impact on them.
 

DND_Reborn

The High Aldwin
If you went with the simplest version of it, the only thing it would change is that PCs and Monsters would all have a W and a VP number..... that's it. Heck for monsters you could just leave them at wounds only if you wanted, since it would rarely have an impact on them.
Maybe. There are a lot of rules/impact of the system in d20 SW that would make things "weird" in D&D if you didn't adjust other things.

FWIW, if we adopt the new system we're considering, HP maximum would basically become Wounds...
 

Oofta

Legend
If you went with the simplest version of it, the only thing it would change is that PCs and Monsters would all have a W and a VP number..... that's it. Heck for monsters you could just leave them at wounds only if you wanted, since it would rarely have an impact on them.

If you do that, what are you buying other than overhead and complexity, especially when you include things like magical healing?

Let's say a PC has (arbitrary numbers here) VP: 30, W: 10 and they take 35 points of damage. There's no difference from HP other than you split up the numbers, right? So at this point they have VP:0, W:5. Now suppose you could recover VP but not W with a short rest so they have VP:30, W:5. They again take 35 points of damage and I assume they drop to 0.

But what about magical healing or bandaids if you have the healer feat? Do you only recover VP? Recover W first? Do you have to actually rest to recover VP or does it recover if you're not doing something that not particularly strenuous so you could be walking around and exploring?
 

If you do that, what are you buying other than overhead and complexity, especially when you include things like magical healing?
A little more clarity in how you describe things. That's all you get, but I'd bet a majority of people who don't like hp as-is would actually be a lot happier with that as the only change.
 

Lanefan

Victoria Rules
Yeah, that's what makes it suck for front liners. You're subject to a bunch more hits, and therefore a lot more nat 20's. It also cuts down on the HP advantage from your class, as it was just based on your Con.
But if you get rid of the idea that crits go straight to WP/BP it then works much more as intended, right?
 

Lanefan

Victoria Rules
Maybe. There are a lot of rules/impact of the system in d20 SW that would make things "weird" in D&D if you didn't adjust other things.
I for one am not even considering the SW system as a starting point, other than perhaps using its names for the two types of hit points.

The SW system as written has some good ideas but then neuters itself in a single stroke: crits bypass VP. Get rid of that one rule and the basis
for a viable and simple system is sitting right there. Too many WP, though; needs to be a smaller and unchanging number.

Toss in something like 4e's bloodied mechanic for when one is at half FP (VP) and you're good to rock!
 

DND_Reborn

The High Aldwin
When we tried it before, this is what we did:
  1. Hit points became Vitality.
  2. Wounds (aka Wound Points and also Mortal Wounds) equaled a creature's Constitution score plus its level or CR, as appropriate.
  3. If HP = 0, damage overflows into Wounds.
  4. Critical hits required a confirmation roll. If the roll misses, double damage dice and apply to HP. If the roll hits, roll normal damage and apply to Wounds.
  5. Armor provides DR vs. Wound damage (to a minimum of 1 Wound), DR equals AC value - 10 (e.g. Plate armor would be DR 8).
  6. Whenever you take Wounds, you make a Constitution save to remain conscious. The DC equals 5 + the damage taken.
  7. If you take any Wound damage, you gain a level of exhaustion.

Now, the issue is in d20 SW, "mooks" had no vitality, so a critical hit could drop them IIRC.

IME with the above system, it penalizes PCs much more than enemies because PCs will need to recover from injury (as where the enemies likely won't ;).

The above was nearly a direction translation of the W/VP system from d20 SW.

For healing:

You recovered 1 Wound per long rest.
Spells and magical healing recovered 1 Wound per spell level. Potions recovered 1-4 Wounds depending on the strength of the potion.

That's all I can remember for now. I probably have an old house-rule doc if anyone wants me to look for it.
 

Vaalingrade

Legend
But if you get rid of the idea that crits go straight to WP/BP it then works much more as intended, right?
What is the intention?

I see people saying it's superior, that it's better than HP... but how?

Even having played in systems with W/V or the equivalent that aren't SW like HERO, which has STUN and Body... nothing being described here seems to have little connection to those.

In most such systems, Wounds/Body is something that rarely comes up or it the special ability of things that are hyper-dangerous and those things have a commiserate lower damage because they're going to wounds, not lobbing 2d6 wounds at you on every single crit.

You don't go into Body every fight in HERO for example, and you don't go into wounds from a fist fight in other systems, but the proposed systems here seem to expect everyone to go into wounds every fight.

Plus, most of these systems provide pretty robust Defense abilities to mitigate both wound and vitality damage, something D&D is terrified of.

I'm not sure what's actually being conceived of here.
 

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