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5E Kingmaker

Zardnaar

Legend
Years ago I ran Pathfinder Kingmaker and enjoyed it earlier on to the extent that The Stolen Lands is one of the best adventures ever made imho.

Recently I also reread the Kingdom rules in Ultimate campaigns. The rules are basically stand alone and seem compatible enough with 5E.

Kingmaker also seems easy enough to convert.

Another idea is to use the rules to claim an area around Phandelver.

Any ideas for using these rules or a settlement in the north?
 
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Ancalagon

Dusty Dragon
My pathfinder group has 2 gms that alternate (6 ish month per) and one of the 2 campaign is in kingmaker. We might switch to 5e and I would be pretty happy about that, even though some of the characters wouldn't translate 100% - my dwarven alchemist would be *very* different for example.
 

Zardnaar

Legend
My pathfinder group has 2 gms that alternate (6 ish month per) and one of the 2 campaign is in kingmaker. We might switch to 5e and I would be pretty happy about that, even though some of the characters wouldn't translate 100% - my dwarven alchemist would be *very* different for example.
Characters will be 5E ones. Not much in the rules ties them to Pathfinder.

Did you use them as written or Ultimate Campaigns version?
 

Ancalagon

Dusty Dragon
Characters will be 5E ones. Not much in the rules ties them to Pathfinder.

Did you use them as written or Ultimate Campaigns version?
I'm not sure what ultimate campaigns is. Do you mean the "kingdom" rules? I heard the GM talking about using the "most recent" version, maybe this is what he meant.
 


aco175

Hero
I would think the region around Phandelver would be a good area for a kingdom. Might want to swing down and encompass Leilon and some of the main road. I would think that both Neverwinter and Waterdeep would be involved in a new kingdom encroaching their circle of influence.
 

practicalm

Explorer
And here I was hoping someone had converted the Avalon Hill board game Kingmaker to D&D.

Fight the War of the Roses with sword and spell. Kill the heirs and then resurrect them back again. Powerful nobles using Lancastrian and Yorkist princes as pawns to gain power.
 

Zardnaar

Legend
I would think the region around Phandelver would be a good area for a kingdom. Might want to swing down and encompass Leilon and some of the main road. I would think that both Neverwinter and Waterdeep would be involved in a new kingdom encroaching their circle of influence.
Might be hard getting them to both sign off on it if you decide to annex parts of the north road.

Phandalin might make a good capital or early settlement. You could build an aqueduct or something to pipe in water from the Sword Mountains. I was thinking of building a keep or something near the LMoP, and perhaps trying to get Phandalin or Leilon etc to join voluntarily and you could run patrols along the roads to keep them safe. Another location could be the castle or where the Green Dragon lives. It oculd let you get a town up and running for half cost a'la Stag Lords fort in Kingmaker.
 

Matrix Sorcica

Adventurer
Legendary Games has the PF kingdom rules etc. from Kingmaker/Ultimate Campaign as converted 5E products on drivethru.rpg. Haven't read them, so can't vouch for quality. A critique seems to be is a 2direct2 conversion.
 


Zardnaar

Legend
Why don't you just run 5e in Golarion? That's what I'm doing right now running Hell's Rebels for a party and it has been fun
New 5E players, they know a little bit about the sword coast nothing about Golarion. Keep it simple. It's an option using FR or Greyhawk God's.
 

New 5E players, they know a little bit about the sword coast nothing about Golarion. Keep it simple. It's an option using FR or Greyhawk God's.
I guess to me investing in the Golarion lore is better because then if you so choose you can easily run more of the awesome APs using 5e. I'm also just not a fan of Faerun in general with all the God NPCs around.
 

Zardnaar

Legend
I guess to me investing in the Golarion lore is better because then if you so choose you can easily run more of the awesome APs using 5e. I'm also just not a fan of Faerun in general with all the God NPCs around.
Most of the good NPCs are gone with the time jump. The north is a bit more 1E in feel.
 


FurtiveNoise

First Post
I can't help you much with moving the setting, as I have enjoyed running my last few 5ed campaigns in Golarion, but here's my perspective as someone who has been running the adventure in 5th ed for the last couple years, players are almost level 10. I DM'ed Pathfinder years ago, but not with Kingmaker rules.

The Ultimate Campaign Kingdom Building rules seem to work quite well and don't directly interact with 5th ed mechanics too much so they work without much change. You'll want to make sure you really absorb these rules, because pausing to look them up for too long in game will kill momentum and enthusiasm for using these mechanics. Also, even players that take interest in the mechanics of running the kingdom will rely on you to keep the rules straight. Make sure you have players that are interested in this subsystem, though if you've run the campaign you know what to expect.

I have noticed a few differences to keep in mind where the system does interact with 5th edition and its bounded accuracy. One boost to your kingdom's stats come from your various leaders/counselors stat modifiers, which in general don't increase as high as in Pathfinder and are mostly capped at +5 (20 in that stat). I recommend including events or rewards that will increase kingdom stats or grant free buildings to make up for this over the course of the campaign.

Economy/Loyalty/Stability all work, but some of the secondary Settlement Stats (Society, Crime, etc.) from buildings are supposed to grant bonuses to specific skill checks made in that city or town. Enough of these bonuses may break the bounded accuracy of 5th ed. Skill checks, especially if a lot of adventuring is done in town. To be honest, this hasn't come up yet my game as I haven't been using the settlement bonuses.. I'd need to assign them to the reduced 5th ed. Skill list, and it just has seemed an unnecessary complication. If you reach a good solution, let me know.

I'm pretty ad-hoc with magic item shops (generating low level scrolls and wondrous items) and have been stingier with money and magic items because Pathfinder adventures tend to give them out in droves and everyone doesn't need a +1 sword in 5th. Some buildings increase the 'base value' of items in that town, but I have ignored this stat, magic item prices are much looser in my world and don't translate to pathfinder ones.

The nature of the adventure really calls for creating your own content and customizing things based on your PC's. Much of the map based hex exploration is isolated pockets of dangerous wildlife or lone beasts. With ample opportunity to rest, these 1-2 fights per day will not challenge the average 5th edition party, or mesh well with the 6 encounters a day design philosophy. After the party was past the first module (and thus high enough level to survive multiple fights) I glossed over or abbreviated some of the hex exploration. I use the 'gritty rest' variant where you don't auto-heal to full each night, but still, the wilderness combats they do have tend to be lethal, tougher challenges because I know they'll rest soon; looking back I think I'd tell my players they could only long rest inside their kingdom, and throw out exceptions for certain isolated dungeons. I didn't want to change up rules once the game was underway. I made up a lot of content tailored to what my party was interested in.

Make sure you include BP's in loot or give players ways to mitigate too much unrest or consumption if you find the math working against them too much. One thing I tried, since I wanted to try a more political campaign at times with different factions to oppose or ally with, was to vary the way they receive their starting Build Points once they get the kingdom building underway. Instead of a lump sum of 50 or whatever the normal starting amount was, I gave them 25 and arranged for small list of factions that would give them more depending on what they intended or promised to do with their new lands. These factions were different nobles from Brevoy (which has an interesting political situation underused in the main adventure), different churches, and other influential figures. Credit for this idea goes to someone on the Paizo forums, which probably hold a lot of good ideas for the campaign but are unlikely to offer much 5th ed help. Good luck!
 

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