[5E] Longer long rests and spell durations

For those of you who have used long rests taking 3 or more days, how did you deal with spell durations. For example, goodberry at 24 hours, higher-slot hex at 24 hours.

It used to be the case that you'd cast goodberry before a long rest using unused spell slots and then regain the slots at the end of the rest. With a 7 day long rest, this isn't possible. Did you increate the duration of goodberry? To 8 days? 14 days?
 

tetrasodium

Adventurer
For those of you who have used long rests taking 3 or more days, how did you deal with spell durations. For example, goodberry at 24 hours, higher-slot hex at 24 hours.

It used to be the case that you'd cast goodberry before a long rest using unused spell slots and then regain the slots at the end of the rest. With a 7 day long rest, this isn't possible. Did you increate the duration of goodberry? To 8 days? 14 days?
The DMG267 gritty realism 7 day long rest ruls IME do not work very well at all, but I can't recall things like food & 24hour spell durations ever even coming up. Lots of items recover charges each day at a particular time, changing to an 8hr short rest & a 7 day long rest means that they will typically recover a charge during a dhort rest & almost always fully recharge during a long rest leading to players regularly using them for alpha/nova strike uses rather than keeping them as a "break glass in case of emergency" trump card in their back pocket. The result of practically every evocation spell equipped recharging t $time magic item is terrible, go with "this has x charges & crumbles when you use them all".

The other big problem is finding a balance for how often to give rests. Short rest classes do ok, long rest classes are brutalized.

The only spell durations that are problematic are the rest related ones like rope trick (still good for ambushes) & tiny hut(too bad not sad for it) or Magnificent mansion (it is a seventh level spell, extend duration to a week & casting time to a few hours)
 

Oofta

Title? I don't need no stinkin' title.
I multiply durations measured in hours or days by 5. Which is completely arbitrary, just easier to multiply. :)
 

NotAYakk

Adventurer
For those of you who have used long rests taking 3 or more days, how did you deal with spell durations. For example, goodberry at 24 hours, higher-slot hex at 24 hours.

It used to be the case that you'd cast goodberry before a long rest using unused spell slots and then regain the slots at the end of the rest. With a 7 day long rest, this isn't possible. Did you increate the duration of goodberry? To 8 days? 14 days?
I don't see the problem.

Sure, you cannot hex, short rest, then adventure. But remember this is intended to make 5 minute adventuring days go away, so the benefits to Warlocks (relative to other classes) will be solid anyhow.

And goodberry, well, it means that with this change feeding 10 people indefinitely takes more than 1 1st level spell slot. Doesn't seem to be a huge concern?

OTOH, Mage Armor is a larger concern. It isn't on a short rest spell caster. That specific issue hasn't come up, but if it does I'd just make up something reasonable on the spot. Like maybe make it "spell slot" duration (it lasts until you regain the spell slot), which also works for Hex if needed.
 
For those of you who have used long rests taking 3 or more days, how did you deal with spell durations.
It depends on the purpose of the change. If the purpose is only to fit the pacing of the campaign, but you want play dynamics to be basically the same, then, sure, any spell duration that'd extend completely through a rest probably needs to be adjusted. Particularly spells that enable a rest. Likewise, anything else that recharges or re-sets, for good or ill, on a 24hr clock would probably need to change to a 1-week clock, to map to the long rest.

If, OTOH, you're trying to change play dynamics, to make the game 'harder,' for instance, then leaving durations alone might be a good idea.
 

Coroc

Adventurer
I use short rest a day and long rest a weekend. Sometimes for practical reasons I allow a "5 minute short rest" if e.g. it is clear the party has exhausted their resources and the normal action would be to withdraw and take a short rest in a safe place (if possible) then I handwave things, unless I got a special case making resource management one of the main challenges in the particular session, e.g. party is chasing / chased.

I never though much about those "rely on short rest class" gimmicks, because I do not have players playing that classes. Ok I have a pally in my group but since the frequency of combats is much lower than the 8/day recommended (although much harder sometimes) I do not see the need to alter my base rule.

But OP is right, kudos for thinking about this topic which I was unaware of. I think if I wanted to have both, I either would change rest duration to standard or (less preferable in this case imho) alter spell durations accordingly.
 

Sadras

Adventurer
To avoid unintended consequences.

For example, I had never thought about the effect this would have on spells like Rope Trick and Mordenkainen's Mansion. A DM might see that the change prevents those spells from fulfilling a role they still want them to fill.
Intended consequences.
That is one half of the reason for the change in the first place.
 

MonkeezOnFire

Adventurer
I once played in a seafaring campaign where we could only take long rests at port. To compensate 24 hour durations were extended to "until you finish a long rest." While my cleric of Vecna never did get to animate any dead, it was a nice rule to have.
 

NotAYakk

Adventurer
I once played in a seafaring campaign where we could only take long rests at port. To compensate 24 hour durations were extended to "until you finish a long rest." While my cleric of Vecna never did get to animate any dead, it was a nice rule to have.
I like the idea of a duration being "spell slot". Ie, it lasts until you regain the spell slot.
 

Gadget

Adventurer
Intended consequences.
That is one half of the reason for the change in the first place.
That depends on the campaign now doesn't it? Many people adjust the Rest cycle because they find cramming the intended 6-8 encounters (or anything close to such) into on "day" problematic, and would like to maintain the balance between short rest and long rest classes. Furthermore, the value and utility of many of the longer duration spells loose a good bit of their utility if the duration is unchanged but the spell slot expended is only recovered long after the spell has expired.

Now, this might be a desired out come for those who want to take full spell casters down a peg, or for a more gritty game; but unless the goal was to curtail the use of those specific spells, I would hazard that the result would be to promote other spells, less adversely affected by the changes.
 

Oofta

Title? I don't need no stinkin' title.
That depends on the campaign now doesn't it? Many people adjust the Rest cycle because they find cramming the intended 6-8 encounters (or anything close to such) into on "day" problematic...
That's the reason I changed rest periods in my campaign. I rarely do dungeon crawls or anything similar so longer periods of time work better. At the same time I don't want to be overly harsh on spellcasters that rely on things like mage armor.
 

5ekyu

Adventurer
I don't see the problem.

Sure, you cannot hex, short rest, then adventure. But remember this is intended to make 5 minute adventuring days go away, so the benefits to Warlocks (relative to other classes) will be solid anyhow.

And goodberry, well, it means that with this change feeding 10 people indefinitely takes more than 1 1st level spell slot. Doesn't seem to be a huge concern?

OTOH, Mage Armor is a larger concern. It isn't on a short rest spell caster. That specific issue hasn't come up, but if it does I'd just make up something reasonable on the spot. Like maybe make it "spell slot" duration (it lasts until you regain the spell slot), which also works for Hex if needed.
There are other issues spawning from sane cause. Look at the number of "if cast every day for..." type effects. If they are not rituals, it means you need multiple casters or significantly higher level casters spending more and more slots between weekly refresh of slots.

Unless you routinely get into guaranteed safe weekly periods - its just about unbelievable to see those options bring practical - getting multiple mages commiting multiple slots over a week. (If you are getting plenty of guaranteed safe weekd off, then the rule is just a calendar stretcher - not making for a lot of play that's much different from a more typical adventuring dsy.)

Ritual casting or its lack becomes much more critical.
 

Chaosmancer

Adventurer
Intended consequences.
That is one half of the reason for the change in the first place.
Right, so don't change the ones you intended to happen. But, not every change is going to be intentional, especially since different DMs intend different results. So, it is worth looking at to see what you wanted to change and what you didn't and adjust.
 

Laurefindel

Explorer
That's the reason I changed rest periods in my campaign. I rarely do dungeon crawls or anything similar so longer periods of time work better. At the same time I don't want to be overly harsh on spellcasters that rely on things like mage armor.
Out of curiosity, as anyone ever made a list of "things like Mage Armor" that would be affected by longer long rests?
 

Sadras

Adventurer
That depends on the campaign now doesn't it?
Maybe. It might also depend on the table.
This was never highlighted as a solution for all campaigns or all tables. It is an optional rule in the DMG afterall.

Now, this might be a desired out come for those who want to take full spell casters down a peg, or for a more gritty game; but unless the goal was to curtail the use of those specific spells, I would hazard that the result would be to promote other spells, less adversely affected by the changes.
But those spells affected are still extremely useful. I do not see Mage Armour, Rope Trick or Leomund's Tiny Hut being used any less at my table.
 

Sadras

Adventurer
Right, so don't change the ones you intended to happen. But, not every change is going to be intentional, especially since different DMs intend different results. So, it is worth looking at to see what you wanted to change and what you didn't and adjust.
I think I have been misunderstood by a couple of posters.

DMs who change up the rest periods (including utilising the alternatives in the DMG) do so specifically and intend for certain spells to lose some of their functionality. Those are intended consequences.

There was a massive thread (200+ pages) which discussed this on Enworld 2 years back about how the 1 hour and 8 hour rests are easily circumvented by using spells such as a Rope Trick and Leomund's Tiny Hut.
One of the many solutions suggested was to change up the rest periods. It is very much known.

You cannot exactly have a gritty campaign when spells bypass any measures taken to make it gritty.
Hence TwoSix's quote

No adjustments. What's the point of making a systemic change if it doesn't impact the meta?
 
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