D&D 5E 5e Updates: Monstrous Compendium

[dave2008]

Well, you "only" had to defeat Bane once.

I updated my previous comparison with thier effective HP

Annam: 4,230
Bane: 1,440

The extra HP is important as now that I have seen what some 3PP epic PCs can do, I know a lvl 30 group of 6 can take out my previous Bane in about 1-3 rounds. That is not acceptable for a greater god IMO. Annam, and these mythic gods in general, will be a much more interesting challenge and may actually test these high level groups.

 

[Matrix Sorcica]

What 3PP product is that? There are several.

So you're basing these designs on the power levels of 3PP material, not the epic boons after 20th, that WotC uses (and presumably base their power levels on)? Why?

 

[dave2008]

What 3PP product is that? There are several.

So you're basing these designs on the power levels of 3PP material, not the epic boons after 20th, that WotC uses (and presumably base their power levels on)? Why?

Both. I have looked at lot of stuff, but primarily Epic Options and Epic Characters on the DMsGuild. However, it is generally true for epic boons too. Obviously the epic boons on the DMG are just a template of what you can do with the concept and it can be expanded with more boons to cover what ever bases you need (which some 3PP have done as well).

However, even with the base boons you can easily get a PC with a very rare magic item getting a +19 to hit without any buffing magic. The same fighter can easily do at least 160-240 HP in one turn on average with an action surge. That is 960-1,440 hp of damage in one round from a 6 party group. They can do that for at least 4 rounds or a total of 3,840 - 5,760 damage.

PS. I don't think WotC did any study of power levels above lvl 20. They have only recently published something more powerful than Tiamat and she isn't really much of a challenge for a well organized tricked out lvl 20 group. Epic boons allow even my un-optimized players to take the official Tiamat to the woodshed for some easy chopping.

EDIT: One difference from my Epic Updates is my assumptions on party size. I was basing my previous ideas on a 4 person group. My group is 6 people and that is what I am basing my assumptions on now. Also, since the monsters don't hit as hard, there is less need to spend time healing the group.

 

[dave2008]

I have added the Empyrean, updated from my old 5e Epic Updates thread. This is just a standard legendary monster

 

[Matrix Sorcica]

Okay, except for the fighter not being able to action surge for 4 rounds I follow. I think most groups are 4-5 PCs btw (totally not-based on anything).

 

[dave2008]

Okay, except for the fighter not being able to action surge for 4 rounds I follow. I think most groups are 4-5 PCs btw (totally not-based on anything).

My fault, some of the epic options can do that, but your right boons cannot, though it would be a reasonable assumption to add such a boon. I mean there is a boon that gives an extra 9th lvl spell slot. Also, that was not optimized damage either - it can get worse (or about the same with the right # of attacks )

FYI, in Epic Characters at lvl 29 a fighter gets 6 attacks per round standard and has 3 action surges for 42 attacks in 4 rounds (vs the 32 I assumed).

Party size is a strange thing. Ultimately I can only try things out with the group I have, So that is why I made the change. I also did some thinking and realized my average group size was 6+, so I just used 6 as my new standard. I actually did an analysis of the encounter guidelines a while back and remember discovering the DMG really assumes a party size of 3 for solo MM monsters. That is a big reason MM monsters feel so weak IMO (because the encounter budgets are off).

 

[dave2008]

Turtle & Ship by Sally Gottschalk

Dragon Turtle, Elder
Gargantuan dragon, neutral

Armor Class 22 (Natural Armor)
Hit Points 462 (28d20 + 168; bloodied 231)
Speed 20 ft., swim 60 ft.

STR	DEX	CON	INT	WIS	CHA
28 (+9)	10 (+0)	22 (+6)	14 (+2)	17 (+3)	16 (+3)

Saving Throws Str +16, Dex +7, Con +13, Wis +10
Skills Athletics +16, Intimidate +10
Damage Resistances fire, piercing
Condition Immunities prone
Senses darkvision 180 ft., passive perception 13
Languages Aquan, Common, Draconic
Challenge 21 (33,000 XP) Proficiency Bonus +7

Amphibious. The dragon turtle can breathe air and water.

Aquatic Senses. If the dragon turtle is submerged, it has advantage on Wisdom (Perception) checks versus submerged targets and it gains tremorsense to 120 feet.

Colossal. The dragon's space is 40 feet by 40 feet.

Magic Weapons. The dragon turtle’s weapon attacks are considered magical weapons.

Ram. If the dragon turtle moves at least 30 feet straight toward a target and then hits it with a bite attack on the same turn, the damage type becomes bludgeoning, it cannot grapple the target, and the target takes an extra 27 (5d10) bludgeoning damage.

Siege Monster. The dragon deals double damage to objects and structures.

Unstoppable (3/Short Rest). At any time, requiring no action, the dragon turtle can take 30 hit points of damage and immediately end one condition or effect it is suffering. After taking the damage, the dragon cannot take reactions until the start of its next turn.

ACTIONS
Multiattack. The dragon turtle makes two bite attacks. It can make one claw or tail attack in place of a bite attack.

Bite. Melee Weapon Attack: +16 to hit, reach 20 ft., one target. Hit: 41 (5d12 + 9) piercing damage and the target must succeed on a DC 24 Strength saving throw or be grappled. If the target is Medium or smaller it is also restrained while it is grappled.

Claw. Melee Weapon Attack: +13 to hit, reach 15 ft., one target. Hit: 26 (5d6 + 9) slashing damage.

Tail. Melee Weapon Attack: +13 to hit, reach 20 ft., one target. Hit: 36 (5d10 + 9) bludgeoning damage. If the target is a creature, it must succeed on a DC 23 Strength saving throw or be pushed up to 10 feet away from the dragon turtle and knocked prone.

Steam Breath (Recharge 5–6). The dragon turtle exhales scalding steam in a 90-foot cone. Each creature in that area must make a DC 21 Constitution saving throw, taking 70 (20d6) fire damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one. Being underwater doesn't grant resistance against this damage.

Innate Spellcasting. The dragon turtle’s spell casting ability is Charisma (spell save DC 18). The dragon turtle can innately cast the following spells, requiring no components:

2/day each: control water, tidal wave

BONUS ACTIONS
Titanic Prey. The dragon turtle can make a claw attack against a Huge or larger target.

REACTIONS
Chomp. If a creature ends its turn grappled by the dragon turtle, the dragon turtle makes a bit attack targeting the creature.

 

[dave2008]

Dieter by BlackSalander

Dragon Turtle, Venerable
Gargantuan dragon, neutral

Armor Class 24 (Natural Armor)
Hit Points 595 (34d20 + 238; bloodied 297)
Speed 30 ft., swim 80 ft.

STR	DEX	CON	INT	WIS	CHA
30 (+10)	10 (+0)	24 (+7)	16 (+3)	19 (+4)	18 (+4)

Saving Throws Str +18, Dex +8, Con +15, Wis +12
Skills Athletics +18, Intimidate +12, Perception +12
Damage Resistances fire, piercing
Condition Immunities prone
Senses darkvision 240 ft., passive perception 22
Languages Aquan, Common, Draconic
Challenge 25 (75,000 XP) Proficiency Bonus +8

Amphibious. The dragon turtle can breathe air and water.

Aquatic Senses. If the dragon turtle is submerged, it has advantage on Wisdom (Perception) checks versus submerged targets and it gains tremorsense to 180 feet.

Colossal. The dragon's space is 60 feet by 60 feet. Additionally, the dragon turtle is immune to all damage, except psychic damage, unless the attack or effect inflicts more than 5 hit points of damage, in which case it takes damage as normal.

Magic Weapons. The dragon turtle’s weapon attacks are considered rare magical weapons.

Ram. If the dragon turtle moves at least 30 feet straight toward a target and then hits it with a bite attack on the same turn, the damage type becomes bludgeoning, it cannot grapple the target, and the target takes an extra 33 (6d10) bludgeoning damage.

Siege Monster. The dragon deals double damage to objects and structures.

Unstoppable (3/Short Rest). At any time, requiring no action, the dragon turtle can take 30 hit points of damage and immediately end one condition or effect it is suffering. After taking the damage, the dragon cannot take reactions until the start of its next turn.

ACTIONS
Multiattack. The dragon turtle makes two bite attacks. It can make one claw or tail attack in place of a bite attack.

Bite. Melee Weapon Attack: +19 to hit, reach 30 ft., one target. Hit: 49 (6d12 + 10) piercing damage and the target must succeed on a DC 27 Strength saving throw or be grappled. If the target is Large or smaller it is also restrained while it is grappled.

Claw. Melee Weapon Attack: +19 to hit, reach 20 ft., one target. Hit: 31 (6d6 + 10) slashing damage.

Tail. Melee Weapon Attack: +19 to hit, reach 30 ft., one target. Hit: 43 (6d10 + 10) bludgeoning damage. If the target is a creature, it must succeed on a DC 27 Strength saving throw or be pushed up to 20 feet away from the dragon turtle and knocked prone.

Steam Breath (Recharge 5–6). The dragon turtle exhales scalding steam in a 90-foot cone. Each creature in that area must make a DC 24 Constitution saving throw, taking 98 (28d6) fire damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one. Being underwater doesn't grant resistance against this damage.

Innate Spellcasting. The dragon turtle’s spell casting ability is Charisma (spell save DC 18). The dragon turtle can innately cast the following spells, requiring no components:

3/day each: control water, tidal wave
1/day: tsunami

BONUS ACTIONS
Titanic Prey. The dragon turtle can make a claw attack against a Huge or larger target.

REACTIONS
Chomp. If a creature ends its turn grappled by the dragon turtle, the dragon turtle makes a bite attack targeting the creature.

Swallow. A Large or smaller creature grappled by the dragon turtle at the end of its turn must make a DC 27 Strength saving throw. On a failure, the grapple ends and the target is swallowed. While swallowed, the creature is blinded and restrained, it has total cover against attacks and other effects outside the dragon turtle, and it takes 45 (8d10) acid damage at the start of each of the dragon turtle’s turns.

The dragon turtle’s stomach has an AC of 19 and if it takes 50 damage or more on a single turn from a creature inside it, the dragon turtle must make a DC 20 Constitution saving throw at the end of that turn or regurgitate all swallowed contents of its stomach. Creatures that are regurgitated fall prone within 10 feet of the dragon turtle. If the dragon turtle dies, a creature is no longer swallowed and may escape from the corpse by using 40 feet of movement, exiting prone.

 

[imeannoharm]

I have added Annam, the giant god pantheon head. It is till a WIP, but I wanted to go ahead and post it. This was originally designed by ??? and I edited and updated to my new staged mythic idea.

Thirteenspades.

 

[imeannoharm]

So will your 30+ monsters remain CR 30+? I'd hate to see gods get nerfed. Will you keep the CR system from your 5e epic monster updates?
Also I noticed a potential problem with the Mythic template: the DPR stays the same when the trait is used, but the HP is doubled, at least. Will you increase the DPR or something along those lines to compensate? Or do the Mythic actions balance the issue?