7th level characters

[trentonjoe]

I am running a game for people I haven't played with before. I want pretty standard PCs with a 20k gp magic item value limit.

What should be the highest limit for attack bonus and AC?

I am thinking AC 24 and +15?

AM I setting the limits to low? to high? are these "average" 7th level characters?

 

[Crothian]

Personally, unless you really need to strat that high, I'd start at first. The balance issues are easier.

As for average, I'd use the NPC tables in the DMG to determine averages.

 

[trentonjoe]

THose values are a little low in my opinion. I tend to play with characters that have better stats. I expect to see a couple of 18s in str as opposed to the 15s in the DMG.

 

[Crothian]

Then you can easily adjust up. Averages are hard to determine especially with so masny options a 7th level character is given.

 

[perivas]

Rather than letting people buy what they want, it might be more fun/effective/logical to work it into the story. Do the characters already know each other as an adventuring group? If so, you could just have a pool of magic items and let them draft the items from the pool one at a time. Example: 20 items, 5 person group.

Player: Draft #:
1 1, 10, 11, 20
2 2, 9, 12, 19
3 3, 8, 13, 18
4 4, 7, 14, 17
5 5, 6, 15, 16

Or you could just assign them items as per the 7th level characters of respective classes in the DMG. For multiclass characters (ex. 3rd rogue, 4th sorceror), you get 3rd rogue and 4th sorceror items. If you want something else, trade-in at high price. Those are just some ideas.

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

It's kinda hard to say what's the upper limit for acceptable attack bonus/Armor Class without knowing the kind of stats the characters will have and what you're permitting. Attack bonusses and armor class will also vary widely depending upon the characters in question.

Using some characters I've seen, these are some things you can probably expect on a 28 point buy.

Armor Class:
Ftr 2/Wiz3/Spellsword 2 (or Ftr2/Wiz 5)
+2 Mithril Chain Shirt, +1 animated large shield, shield spell, protection from evil spell, 14 dex (16 to 18 with Cat's Grace) and dodge. AC 30/31 to 32/33
With Expertise: potentially 37
With Expertise and Haste (Ftr 2/Wiz 5): up to 41 (higher if gnome or halfling)

Alternately:
Ftr 4/Bbn2/Sor 1
+2 Fullplate, +2 large steel shield, wand of shield, ring of protection +1, amulet of natural armor +1, Dex 12
AC 33

Without a Shield Spell:
Ftr 7
+3 fullplate, +2 large steel shield, amulet of Natural Armor +1, Dex 13, Dodge
AC 27
(This will go up to 30 if the character gets the cleric to cast shield of faith on him)

Attack Bonus
Half orc Ftr 4/Bbn 3
18 strength, +2 greatsword, weapon focus, weapon specialization
+14/+9 for 2d6+10 damage
raging +16/+11 for 2d6+13 damage
With Bull's Strength bless, and prayer, this will naturally look uglier.

Alternately (although this is a 30 point character)
Elf Clr 7 (Shevarash--although Solonor Thelandira would do)
BAB +5, 16 Dex (+3), +2 longbow (+2), Greater Magic weapon on arrows (+2), bracer's of Archery (+2) Weapon focus: longbow (+1), Cat's Grace (+1 or +2)
+15 (+16 or +17 w/ Cat's Grace) for 1d8+4
w/in 30 feet +16 (+17 or +18) for 1d8+6
And when she casts Divine Power, Bless, and Divine Favor, this will hit +23 within 30 feet (although realistically, she'll be using Rapid shot so it'll only be +21/+21/+16)

That character, however isn't really maxed for attack bonus. Take a 20 dex, elvish fighter (buffed by his friends) for real attack bonus ugliness.

I'm sure that both attack bonus and armor class can get higher through the use of prestige classes and twisted class combinations but those are what I would expect to be the high end of what you could expect to see on 7th level characters. The characters could probably squeeze another point or two by sacrificing other stats or not buying magic weapons (the AC boosters--keep in mind this is almost practical for the fighter/mage who could potentially cast Greater Magic Weapon instead of having a real magic weapon) or really skimping on defensive items and stats (the attack bonus maximizers). If you permit characters with item crafting feats to gain a discount on items they craft themselves, you may see even more creativity.

On the whole, though, all of the characters listed above are reasonably well rounded and haven't min-maxed their attributes very much. The highest stat on any of them (before racial mods) is a 16.

 

[Shin Okada]

IMHO limiting AC and maximum attack bonus is not fun. And do not work for spell caster types. Just limit what book is available (I usually play only with core rules and without any prestige classes. But that is my taste anyway.). Also, set the maximum value of one item. For example, if you give them 20K gold, set the maximum value of one item to 5K or so. Usually, this way is enough.

 

[Iku Rex]

AM I setting the limits to low? to high?

What's the point of those limits? Just have them make standard 7th level characters and make sure they follow the rules.

The only limits you may want to set is on what books, spells, feats and prestige classes are available.

 

[durath]

Maybe your players are different but I would really resent being given the restrictions you propose.

Its your campaign but I would further recommend letting them draw up their charcters as they see fit by only using the books you say are allowed. That way they have freedom to design their PC the way they want it to be.

 

[reapersaurus]

What should be the highest limit for attack bonus and AC?

I am thinking AC 24 and +15?

AM I setting the limits to low? to high? are these "average" 7th level characters?

What the heck do you mean by "normal"?
"Average characters?"

My guess is that you aren't familiar with the 3E rules, and are just looking for a roleplaying get-together.

That's cool and all, but if you have people that like to power-game (which is an integral part of the GAME-playing aspect to me), than you are being incredibly close-minded by thinking of "limits" to keep their creativity down.