A different Haste

[Eltern]

Haste
Transmutation
Level: Brd 4, Sor/Wiz 4
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Targets: One creature/level, no two of which can be more than 30 ft. apart
Duration: 1 round/level
Saving Throw: Fortitude negates (harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)

The target creature(s) gain one move-equivalent action per round. This could be used to double move and attack, move and make a full attack, cast a full-round spell and move, etc. If a target has the Spring Attack feat, he or she could use this move action to use the full attack action while still moving his or her speed in the round.

What you guys think? Fits my idea of what haste does better, and isn't stupidly broken like "gain a STANDARD" action. At least I don't think it's broken...should I up it to 5th?

Thanks!
Eltern

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

Which Version?

3.5 did away with move equivilent actions.. so unless you are using 3.0 rules...

IIRC, the 3.5 version of haste grants an extra partial action.. which fits a whole lot better.

 

[Terath Ninir]

Ya know, I play 3.5, and *I* get annoyed about the automatic assumption that everybody else does, too...

But I come not here to complain! I come to give you actual feedback, because this forum is for feedback and not for useless snarky comments! I think the spell is lovely and covers the idea of "haste" much better than the official spell. Haste should be, in my mind, about moving fast, not hitting people more often. You could work on the wording if you ever think about publishing, but otherwise it's fine.

I think 4th level is fine for the spell, since it affects 1 creature/level. Movement is less powerful than extra attacks, so I think it all balances out. I think it's too weak for 5th.

 

[Eltern]

Umm, not to be offensive, Primitive Screwhead, but isn't everything that you said...wrong?

Yes, I am a 3.5er, should have made that clear. Now the real question is, if it were a -third- level spell, just up and replacing 3.0 or 3.5 haste, would it be overpowered?

3.0: It's just weaker, so I guess not.
3.5: Trade in a group of assorted bonuses for one distinct bonus, which will be used more often. With normal 3.5 haste, you will either use the single bonus attack, or the additional 30ft move (can't use both in a round). With this haste, you will get the additional 30ft (for most people) and probably at least one extra attack. However, you do not get any of the numerical bonuses to extra factors, and your extra attack will be NOT be at your highest bonus. I think, as compared to 3.5 haste as written, it's a bit too powerful, so I jumped it to 4th. However, looking at other 4th level spells, it doesn't seem that great.

Eltern

 

[glass]

3.5 did away with move equivilent actions.. so unless you are using 3.0 rules...

IIRC, the 3.5 version of haste grants an extra partial action.. which fits a whole lot better.

Umm, not to be offensive, Primitive Screwhead, but isn't everything that you said...wrong?

No the first bit was right. 3.5 did do away with move equivalent actions. However, it also did away with partial actions, so the second bit is definately wrong.

As for your variant, it looks OK balance-wise, but I would consider giving at least a small AC bonus for flavour reasons. It just makes sense to me that magically enhanced speed would make you harder to hit.


glass.

 

[Nifft]

3.5e certainly did not do away with move actions. They did away with the term "partial action", which has always been a synonym for "standard action". Eltern, you have the terms correct.

This spell is quite strong. It's like the 2nd level XPH psionic power Hustle, but that lasts only one round.

Extra move actions are strong. You can Charge and get a full attack, or move -> attack -> move, or cast a full-round spell and move. So it's got to count for as much as Lion's Charge and Spring Attack and Expeditious Retreat all rolled into one.

IMHO, for a 3rd level spell, it should be:
- Single-target
- Duration 1 round + 1 round/2 levels

(Remember that the old 3.0e Haste was single-target. There was a 6th level Mass Haste.)

-- N

 

[Eltern]

Hmm, at least in my head, a 3rd level Haste, that gives an extra move-action, to one target, for duration of 1 round + 1round/2 levels works. Much nicer than anything else on the market Then make a 5th level version that has the same duration, but one creature/level.

 

[Nifft]

Hmm, at least in my head, a 3rd level Haste, that gives an extra move-action, to one target, for duration of 1 round + 1round/2 levels works. Much nicer than anything else on the market Then make a 5th level version that has the same duration, but one creature/level.

Glad you like. It's especially good with a Rod of Lesser Quickening.

Going by the 3.0e versions, Mass Haste would be a 6th level spell. I'm prone to err on the conservative side.

-- N

 

[Dimwhit]

I don't know. I'm going to respectfully disagree with a couple of you. I like the spell, but I don't think it's particularly strong, especially at 4th level. I'd make that spell above a 3rd level spell. At 4th level, I would add a +2 dodge or haste bonus to AC as well.

But that's just me.

 

[Deaths_Fist]

Since we're on the subject...

If one took the original 3.0 version of haste and had to make it a higher-level spell in order to be balanced, what spell level do you folks think it would be? Or is the general consensus that there's no way making it higher level would balance it? What about with a shorter duration, say one round per two or three caster levels?