A little idea to fix Kobold Shifty

andarilhor

First Post
Many times WOTC has said the shifty power of the kobold has to be powered down, so I thinked of a little tweak which can work:

Shifty Kobold Racial
Encounter
Minor Action
Effect:
You can shift 1 square.
Special: As a minor action, you can recharge this power if it's has been expended this encounter.
 

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Burrito Al Pastor

First Post
Kobolds are so freakin' awesome that they deserve an OP racial power. Having two shifts also makes them tactically fascinating, which is wholly appropriate, given their approach to combat.
 


keterys

First Post
Yeah - basically I think allowing them to shift 2 squares in a turn is not necessarily bad, but allowing them to shift 1 square out of threat, take a full move, then a charge or deft strike to somewhere else... it all just starts getting a little extreme.
 


Plane Sailing

Astral Admin - Mwahahaha!
Why not just trim out your 'special' line, so it looks like this?

Shifty Kobold Racial
Encounter
Minor Action
Effect:
You can shift 1 square.

i.e. Kobolds get to shift as a minor action once per encounter. I'd imagine that they would get to use this ability in every encounter and would fit the 'per encounter' design of most (all?) other racial powers.
 

FireLance

Legend
It's just me or this don't change so much in the actual mechanics?
It means that in order to shift as a minor action, you must have already shifted earlier on your turn with your move action or by using a power. You can't, for example, use a minor action to shift out of a threatened square, move your speed, and then make a ranged attack. At most, you can use your move action to shift out of the threatened square and your minor action to shift another square. This puts less distance between you and the opponent that was threatening you.
 

FireLance

Legend
Why not just trim out your 'special' line, so it looks like this?

i.e. Kobolds get to shift as a minor action once per encounter. I'd imagine that they would get to use this ability in every encounter and would fit the 'per encounter' design of most (all?) other racial powers.
I think it seems rather weak in comparison to most other racial encounter powers.

Perhaps instead of spending a minor action to recharge, it recharges when flanked, or when adjacent to two or more enemies?
 

Eh, I dunno... I think the Kobold as printed in the MM makes for a fine PC race. It has a nice, powerful racial ability (shifty) and relatively little else going for it. +2 to defenses vs. Traps is nice, but it's not really any better than the Dwarf's +5 vs Poision saves. +2 Con/Dex doesn't really fit classes as well as the other, classic races. +2 to two skills is standard issue, and the Kobold doesn't even have Low-Light vision.

If I would change anything, I would merely restrict the Kobold from using both a normal Shift and Shifty on the same turn.
 

Smeelbo

First Post
...and the Kobold doesn't even have Low-Light vision.
MM 167-169, kobolds have darkvision.

Between shifty and darkvision, kobolds are the scariest low level monsters I have encountered so far.

I try to read as little of the Monster Manual as possible, so I get more enjoyment out of the game as a player, so there may well be scarier low level monsters.

Smeelbo
 



MM 167-169, kobolds have darkvision.

Between shifty and darkvision, kobolds are the scariest low level monsters I have encountered so far.

I try to read as little of the Monster Manual as possible, so I get more enjoyment out of the game as a player, so there may well be scarier low level monsters.

Smeelbo

Monster Kobolds have Darkvision, yes, but the NPC stats at the back of the book for them don't.

Again, Shifty's a powerful ability, yes... but that's pretty much ALL the Kobold (as currently written) has going for it.
 

dragon23ca

First Post
Yeah - basically I think allowing them to shift 2 squares in a turn is not necessarily bad, but allowing them to shift 1 square out of threat, take a full move, then a charge or deft strike to somewhere else... it all just starts getting a little extreme.

Your right, and as its written and by the rules you can't do that. According to the PHB if you make any double move action at all, they must be the same action. So just because the kobold can shift as a minor action, it can't move a normal move after shifting any more then if some other monster or PC used its standard action to shift, and wanted to move its full movement, it can't. You have to either shift twice or move twice, you can never do one of each in the same turn.
 

Smeelbo

First Post
Your right, and as its written and by the rules you can't do that. According to the PHB if you make any double move action at all, they must be the same action. So just because the kobold can shift as a minor action, it can't move a normal move after shifting any more then if some other monster or PC used its standard action to shift, and wanted to move its full movement, it can't. You have to either shift twice or move twice, you can never do one of each in the same turn.
Incorrect.
PHB 284 said:
If you take the same move action twice in a row--two talks, two runs, two shifts, two crawls--you're taking a double move.
Nothing written requires you to take a double move if you take two move actions, only that if you take two move actions in a row, and they are both the same move action, then you are taking a double move. If you take two move actions, and they are different move actions, or aren't in a row, then it is not a double move.

Indeed, PHB268 Substituting Actions, Option C, you can take two move actions, and next page, "in any order you wish." Finally, as written, Shifty is a Minor Action, not a Move Action, and hence cannot be considered part of a Double Move. If Shifty instead substituted a Shift Move Action for a Minor Action, then you could Double Move with it.

Maybe an adequate solution to Shifty is to change it so that it is a free shift immediately after a successful attack. That would preserve the basic kobold tactics, but would not be reliable.

Smeelbo
 

dragon23ca

First Post
Incorrect.Nothing written requires you to take a double move if you take two move actions, only that if you take two move actions in a row, and they are both the same move action, then you are taking a double move. If you take two move actions, and they are different move actions, or aren't in a row, then it is not a double move.

Indeed, PHB268 Substituting Actions, Option C, you can take two move actions, and next page, "in any order you wish." Finally, as written, Shifty is a Minor Action, not a Move Action, and hence cannot be considered part of a Double Move. If Shifty instead substituted a Shift Move Action for a Minor Action, then you could Double Move with it.

Maybe an adequate solution to Shifty is to change it so that it is a free shift immediately after a successful attack. That would preserve the basic kobold tactics, but would not be reliable.

Smeelbo
Your Right, my mistake. Or more accuracy my friends mistake. In his game I wanted to shift, move, minor action, and spend a action point to attack. And he said I counld't. That I had to double move if I wanted two move actions, and I could either double shift or double move. But I just looked up shift and right under the box it says 'You might find it useful to first shift away from an
adjacent enemy, then walk or run.'. So next game he runs I'm showing him that. He spoiled my whole plan when he told me that.
 

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