A momentary lapse of good DM judgement killed all my players.

[Pielorinho]

I think you are sort of missing the point here. Why would someone decide (and announce) that they aren't going to tune the encounters to the party level?

Sorry -- my first post here was responding to something in your post that I may have been taking out of context. I don't at all object to folks' playing gritty death-filled games, and if Spunedagr is doing that, I totally recognize that can be fun.

I was just explaining why folks might, in general, want to fudge on dice-rolls to save PCs. If you weren't calling fudging in general silly, my apologies.

Daniel

 

[BSF]

Personally, I think you did the "right thing". The point is to have fun. It sounds like the party was a bit underpowered for this, so the combat probably wasn't even very fun for them. I also call this a legitimate save because _you_ felt that as the DM, _you_ made a judgement error with the Wisdom check.

As far as everything else goes...

At the onset of the campaign, I told them that there would be some tailored encounters, but that there would also be some encounters that were not tailored. It was up to them to identify the ones that they are outmatched on and to run or die. They have done a good job so far.

I have pulled my punches from time to time. Usually, the players don't really know it. I have certainly killed them off enough times for them to not think I am just a softie. When I pull the punches, it is because I may have overestimated something and it is not a time when I want someone to die. So, maybe they just went KO.

At some point, I got tired of the number crunching around the table. "Ok, you are at -3, we don't need to heal you quite yet, you might stablize and we might take this thing down before then." So, I stopped telling them what the HP were at when they went negative. I just tell everyone that the character(s) fell. Now, they have to ignore that, or somebody has to determine the status of the downed character(s). It has made my combats a bit more dramatic and they usually get somebody with healing over there much quicker. Every so often, the downed character is dead and no amount of healing will help at the moment. Sometimes the character death is obvious (yardshaft through the head) and they know that they will pick up the corpse afterward.

But, overall, I focus on having fun. That is what I want the game to be about, regardless of whether I am letting the dice fall where they may, or pulling the punches, or even resetting events if I biffed a judgement call.

 

[mythusmage]

That said, as soon as the character attacked, the 'loth blasphemed like a mofo and everyone except the wizard (he's an Athar - immune to that spell) was instantly paralyzed. The 'loth then started hacking the upstart fool into little bits. The wizard tried his darndest to save everybody else by distracting the 'loth with a summon monster. That tweaked him off, so he firestormed the lot of 'em, dropping every person to -20 hp.

Did he have to kill them? It's a waste of customers after all. Seems to me you misplayed the ultroloth more than the encounter.

Unwise PC attacks, others join in. Ultroloth paralyses all but one in party. Ultroloth and unparalyzed party member engage in negotiations while the rest of the party fuss and fume about not being able to participate.

Daemonic evil is a more sophisticated evil than that of the demons or devils. A lot of it depends upon reputation. Letting a bunch of mortals spread the tale of how they were rendered helpless by a lone ultroloth is a beautiful way of enhancing that reputation.

'Twould also earn him some enmity. But as long as their gold is bright yellow, why should he care?

(When you're 50,000 years old with an Everest sized ego epic arrogance sort of comes natural to you.)

 

[reapersaurus]

umm... why are your players in the habit of risking their PC's lives, and the cohesiveness of your entire campaign, on a simple Wisdom roll (and the subsequent vagaracies of a dice roll)?

 

[Reynard]

At some point, I got tired of the number crunching around the table. "Ok, you are at -3, we don't need to heal you quite yet, you might stablize and we might take this thing down before then." So, I stopped telling them what the HP were at when they went negative. I just tell everyone that the character(s) fell. Now, they have to ignore that, or somebody has to determine the status of the downed character(s). It has made my combats a bit more dramatic and they usually get somebody with healing over there much quicker. Every so often, the downed character is dead and no amount of healing will help at the moment. Sometimes the character death is obvious (yardshaft through the head) and they know that they will pick up the corpse afterward.

This is why I keep track of PC hit points when I run games. I let people know how hurt they are, in general and using descriptive language. That way, no one makes decisions based on numbers. For the first while I did it, it was a little rough and people wasted healing or went down. over time, though, I learned to effectively communicate how wounded they were so such things did not happen.

 

[BSF]

This is why I keep track of PC hit points when I run games. I let people know how hurt they are, in general and using descriptive language. That way, no one makes decisions based on numbers. For the first while I did it, it was a little rough and people wasted healing or went down. over time, though, I learned to effectively communicate how wounded they were so such things did not happen.

Agreed! But I run a group of 7 people and I am sometimes too lazy to break out the laptop to keep track. As the character's HP decrease, they grow increasingly panicked. Of course, I am wacky enough that I can tell you most of the stats for each character ... without looking at their character sheets. (I think that disturbs them when I can describe and attack with flavor, tell them that they just took ability damage, rattle off the affects to secondary abilities, and tell them their current stat total before they have figured it out. Especially when they know they don't see any of their character sheets anywhere near me.) Anyway, I can usually judge how good/bad they are doing and if I lose track, I can hear most of their whispering around the table. If I am concerned, I keep track. Otherwise, I let it roll and they may die.

Anyway, I do like to keep track of their HP damage myself for the big fights and just give them descriptive attacks. Speaking of which, I have a massive battle with a cult and a demon coming up this weekend. It should be the campaign ender. It will be fun!

 

[Feathercircle]

Funny, I've got almost the exact opposite problem coming up in the near future... my players caught onto what I had planned as a minor background thread involving cranium rats and pursued it completely out of proportion, keeping me on my toes inventing as I go along... which is all well and good, other than the fact that they seem hell-bent on fighting the bare-brained rodents long before I'm ready for them to do so! They're level 3, and they probably won't be more than level 4 or MAYBE 5 before they get there, and they want to go up against a pack of over 40 rats!

I can't think of a way out of this without killing every single one of them... they're charging in that much over their heads, no matter how many hints I drop... they KNOW how dangerous cranium rats are in numbers that great, and they still seem to be planning on going through with this... If they fight, they'll lose, so the only option I can see is for me to find a way to keep them from fighting.. Any ideas, anyone?

Meanwhile, I admire your humilty, Spune, and I think you did a marvellous job of handling things.

I disagree slightly with your Transcendant player, though... My personal understanding of the Ciphers is that the optimal condition is one in which thought and action are one and the same, two parts of a single whole... action without thought is nearly as bad as thought without action.
But then again, I'm a Clueless, so I could very easily be wrong. Simply BEAUTIFUL salvaging of a bad situation, either way.

 

[Djeta Thernadier]

Excellent way to fix it though.

Very, VERY cool.

And I can see "A momentary lapse of good DM judgement killed all my players" bumper stickers....

 

[Seule]

I think you handled it pretty well, but in retrospect, I'd have said that a blown Wis check (and it really should have been Knowledge) would yield no information rather than misinformation. Not knowing if they could take it would hopefully make them more cautious than thinking they could, while still keeping them in the dark, as per a blown roll.

--Seule

 

[Leopold]

Farg 'em. They hosed it they die, tough tootoo.