A power attack feat for ranged weapons...

[Quartz]

I don't see how Power Attack doesn't apply to thrown weapons anyway - as long as you're applying your Strength modifier you should be able to use Power Attack.

Strength Bonus: When you hit with a melee or thrown weapon, including a sling, add your Strength modifier to the damage result

How can you tell someone they can use Power Attack when hitting someone with a spear but not when they throw the same spear?

 

[Felnar]

The mechanic doesn't represent pulling back further on the string, but taking lose aim at specific areas. The result is a lesser likelyhood of striking, but those shots inflicting more damage when they do.

This concept actually exists IRL. It's the basis of any automatic small arms weapon (why give the M-16 A2 a three round burst option?). Those who want to test this can try it on first person shooters, especially those with weapons that offer one hit kills if you hit specific locations (disc launcher to the head!!). Those that can't shoot accurately shoot alot, with similar results.

i thought the reason for burst fire (compared to semi-auto/singleshot) was not increased accuracy, but decreasing the aim time required to hit a certain sized target at a certain range (maybe human sized at 100 yards).
burst fire doesnt increase damage (other than multiple hits)

i'm picturing rapid shot as burst fire,
or this type of feat as using your bow "mighty'er" than you normally would/could

other quick thoughts:
after think on it, power attack (melee) mechanics are pretty weird in general, and seem better suited to a armor as DR game.

and i'm thinking more about the critcal hits system.
its there for these hits to the vitals, so improved critcal may be the feat for you
so maybe feat to emulate the slow careful aiming/stability of the sniper, time vs vital accuracy

all of the above might be wrong, please point out where i've typed faster than i've rethunk

 

[ChimericDream]

The thing about ranged attacks is: you get a lot of them. More than a melee guy gets on average, because you don't have to move as often.

So, I'd want a "careful aim" feat to feature more damage vs. fewer attacks rather than less precision.

Maybe something like...

Careful Aim [Fighter]
You deal a lot of damage when you take the time to focus on a shot.
Prerequisites: Point-Blank Shot, BAB 6+, Wisdom 13+
Benefit: You can make a single careful shot as a full attack action. Your careful shot deals an extra +1d8 damage for every potential attack you give up. (So, if you have a BAB of 8, you would lose your second iterative attack and deal an extra +1d8 damage. If you had the Rapid Shot feat, you could elect to deal an additional +1d8 damage in exchange for taking a -2 penalty on attack. If you were hasted, you'd get yet another +1d8 damage.)

How's that look?

Cheers, -- N

I like this version. I'll need to tweak it a bit for my campaign, but I'm yoinking it. Thanks, Nifft!

 

[airwalkrr]

The problem with the whole line of thinking on power attacks with ranged weapons (specifically projectile weapons and not so much thrown weapons) is that the idea of sacrificing accuracy for the sake of more power to the projectile is ludicrous. There is simply no way mechanically that it would make sense. It makes sense for power attack, where the attacker is simply putting the full effort of his strength towards swinging and throwing caution to the wind, but how would one do this with a bow or a crossbow? Quite ridiculous IMO.

 

[Felnar]

Careful Aim [Fighter]
You deal a lot of damage when you take the time to focus on a shot.
Prerequisites: Point-Blank Shot, BAB 6+, Wisdom 13+
Benefit: You can make a single careful shot as a full attack action. Your careful shot deals an extra +1d8 damage for every potential attack you give up. (So, if you have a BAB of 8, you would lose your second iterative attack and deal an extra +1d8 damage. If you had the Rapid Shot feat, you could elect to deal an additional +1d8 damage in exchange for taking a -2 penalty on attack. If you were hasted, you'd get yet another +1d8 damage.)

oops, i forgot to comment on this
looks great Nifft, but could you explain the Point-Blank Shot and Wisdom prereqs?

 

[Felnar]

OT i guess, but i figured out why power attck seems weird to me
why does power attack take a penalty to-hit?
swinging harder (ie. high strength) gets a bonus to-hit
swinging harder (ie. power attack) takes a penalty to-hit
why is swinging hard with a feat different from swinging hard with stats?

 

[CRGreathouse]

OT i guess, but i figured out why power attck seems weird to me
why does power attack take a penalty to-hit?
swinging harder (ie. high strength) gets a bonus to-hit
swinging harder (ie. power attack) takes a penalty to-hit
why is swinging hard with a feat different from swinging hard with stats?

Extra strength gives you more muscular control and the ability to whip the sword about faster. Attacking recklessly, like attempting great overhead swings or the like, makes it harder to hit. The first isn't about changing your attack, just doing it better;the second is about changing the way you swing to perhaps greater effect.

 

[Storyteller01]

i thought the reason for burst fire (compared to semi-auto/singleshot) was not increased accuracy, but decreasing the aim time required to hit a certain sized target at a certain range (maybe human sized at 100 yards).
burst fire doesnt increase damage (other than multiple hits)

RIght, but firearms don't operate on a damage quotent. Throwing more rounds down range increases your odds of hitting something vital quickly.

 

[Storyteller01]

The problem with the whole line of thinking on power attacks with ranged weapons (specifically projectile weapons and not so much thrown weapons) is that the idea of sacrificing accuracy for the sake of more power to the projectile is ludicrous. There is simply no way mechanically that it would make sense. It makes sense for power attack, where the attacker is simply putting the full effort of his strength towards swinging and throwing caution to the wind, but how would one do this with a bow or a crossbow? Quite ridiculous IMO.

The idea wasn't to use 'the arrow hits harder'. It's 'aim is looser, decreasing accuracy while increasing lethality'. It's the same with Rapid Shot and TWF. It uses nearly identical mechanics to explain differing fighting methods (using two weapons versus shooting faster).

 

[green slime]

Careful Aim [Fighter]
You deal a lot of damage when you take the time to focus on a shot.
Prerequisites: Point-Blank Shot, BAB 6+, Wisdom 13+
Benefit: You can make a single careful shot as a full attack action. Your careful shot deals an extra +1d8 damage for every potential attack you give up. (So, if you have a BAB of 8, you would lose your second iterative attack and deal an extra +1d8 damage. If you had the Rapid Shot feat, you could elect to deal an additional +1d8 damage in exchange for taking a -2 penalty on attack. If you were hasted, you'd get yet another +1d8 damage.)

How's that look?

Cheers, -- N

It looks mechanically remarkably similar to multishot, only better: instead of suffering a -2 penalty for each arrow, you don't suffer a penalty at all, and it guarantees +1d8 damage, instead of repeating arrow damage (which may only be 1d6). The only advantage multishot has is that it could be combined with a move action... not unreasonable.

I admit I liked it when I first saw it, but I'd like you to respond to the following questions.

Why couldn't your Careful Aim be applied to melee weapons as well (changing the prerequisites as appropriate)?
Why doesn't it repeat base weapon damage, instead of a fixed +1d8 (halflings throwing daggers and Titans weilding Huge Great Bows gain the same benefit??)
Perhaps, in a similar vein to sneak attacking with ranged weapons, a limit to the range at which it could apply? Short or Medium, perhaps?

Just throwing out random ideas here. I did like the feat.