D&D 5E A simple questions for Power Gamers, Optimizers, and Min-Maxers.

[TwoSix]

She was totally wise! She knew that the best way to teach me Russian was through immersion, so she just dropped me off in Russia.

Wasn't that hard, either, after I got out of the gulag.

Я на самом деле не владеют русским языком.

 

[Morrus]

Я на самом деле не владеют русским языком.

Man, that was close. Do you know how much like a spam post that looks? I stopped it in time!

 

[Caliban]

By whom? I don't recall seeing that in the PHB or DMG. If one is optimizing they are inherently meta-gaming. No I personally don't have an issue with that, but to some that is anathema to role-playing.

A) It IS still a game after all.

B) I would disagree that choosing options that make your character better at their chosen role is inherently metagaming. That's what most of the the options are there for. Deliberately seeking out and using the combinations that have unintended effects or synergies - that is metagaming.

C) I can't understand the idea that optimizing is anathema to roleplaying. You can roleplay well or poorly regardless of your character's actual abilities. That has to do with the player, not the character. There are certainly people who are good at optimizing and bad at roleplaying, and vice versa, but I also know people who are good at both and who are bad at both. (Poorly built characters and cardboard personalities - but the player is a nice guy and fun to hang out with.)

 

[TwoSix]

Man, that was close. Do you know how much like a spam post that looks? I stopped it in time!

I'll keep my postings in English, then. I'm confusing enough in my native language.

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[dave2008]

A) It IS still a game after all.

Yes, is there a point here?

B) I would disagree that choosing options that make your character better at their chosen role is inherently metagaming. That's what most of the the options are there for. Deliberately seeking out and using the combinations that have unintended effects or synergies - that is metagaming.

Simply choosing options to make your character better is not what I meant by optimizing. I should have been more clear, I apologize. I was thinking a long the lines of reading through all the possible class features, feats, spells, etc. and choosing the better / best options for what will come in the future. It is a thin line, and I don't really care about it so I may be misrepresenting both sides, but it seems to me the heavy role-players would be against looking forward beyond what one's current abilities are.

C) I can't understand the idea that optimizing is anathema to roleplaying. You can roleplay well or poorly regardless of your character's actual abilities. That has to do with the player, not the character. There are certainly people who are good at optimizing and bad at roleplaying, and vice versa, but I also know people who are good at both and who are bad at both. (Poorly built characters and cardboard personalities - but the player is a nice guy and fun to hang out with.)

Agreed, they are separate things IMO. It is the same reason I don't understand why people separate combat from role-playing. Hell, my groups do 75%+ of their role-playing in combat!

 

[Lanefan]

I don't think so. You made it pretty clear that you think other players should cater to your ideas of how the game should be played.

As you've interpreted my words, anyway. Maybe I need to be clearer...

I don't have a problem playing with people who make non-optimized characters, I do it all the time and it can be a lot of fun.

Which seems to reverse your earlier position where you complain that non-optimized characters (your term was "gimps", I think) just get other characters killed and thus are not fun at all.

It's the players who make non optimized character and then whine about being outshined that annoy me. Sound like anyone here?

Again, the mirror view: an optimizer who then complains about having one or more non-optimized charaters (gimps) in the party.

There's that bias again. It's not about you.

You're right. It's not.

You and your character don't enter into the equation (unless we are discussing character roles before the start of the campaign, but you probably consider that another dirty power gamer trick).

I don't consider discussing character roles before puck drop a "dirty power gamer trick" at all; but I do find it sometimes leads to people playing a role they might not have wanted to play, just because it needs filling. Personally, my preference is to have players roll up their characters independently; and if a role really needs filling once the game begins they can always go find an NPC adventurer for it.

I play the character whose abilities and personality are what I decided on, not some random loser determined by die rolls.

And here your bias shows up, as your "random loser" might be someone else's gleefully accepted roleplaying challenge. Abilities aside, personality is (almost) completely independent of any dice rolls...one can play a haughty noble's daughter or a down-on-his-luck mercenary soldier in character no matter what their mechanical abilities (or even class or race, for that matter) might be; as mechanics aren't necessary for that and sometimes even get in the way.

IMO an optimizer/power gamer is someone who focuses more on the numbers (and what advantages may be gained from them) than the personality. Me, I'd rather focus on the personality; and I don't at all mind saying I'd prefer others at the table mostly do likewise. Is that so bad?

That said, I think you and I playing at the same table could be...interesting.

Lan-"as you've left these sign-offs to me I'd better not disappoint"-efan

 

[TwoSix]

Katana, phonetically in Russian, is (wait for it) Kатана.

While languages may separate us, thri-kreen katanas are truly universal.

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[Caliban]

A
IMO an optimizer/power gamer is someone who focuses more on the numbers (and what advantages may be gained from them) than the personality. Me, I'd rather focus on the personality; and I don't at all mind saying I'd prefer others at the table mostly do likewise. Is that so bad?

Yes it is. You want to dictate how others play and enjoy the game, based on your own selfish desires. i.e. You think they should play the way you do, so that you enjoy the game more.

Personally, I focus on both the numbers and the personality and backstory of my character. Coming up with an interesting build and then coming up with a backstory to explain how and why the character would make those choices and learn those abilities, then deciding what kind of personality that would result in.

That said, I think you and I playing at the same table could be...interesting.

I kinda doubt it. You are far too controlling towards other players.