Aiming Fireballs soi they don't hit the party?

[ThirdWizard]

Oh, and the way we do it we don't point to squares all the time. If the player and DM know that its possible to aim the spell such that it only affects X, Y, and Z, then we don't calculate it out. We just say, I aim it so it hits X, Y, and Z.

 

[Ovinomancer]

Personally, I use a house rule where a spellcaster has to roll a d20 to hit the square he is aiming for with spells like fireball.

9-20 it's on target, 1-8 it's in one of the squares adjacent to it.

So, if the spellcaster in question is also a renowned archer, known for his ability to gauge distance, weather, and all other factors to consistantly hit his target, he has an equal chance to miss as the clumsiest mage in the lands? Odd.

The usual (AFAIK) method for attacking a square/intersection is to assign an AC of 5 (base AC of 10 with a 0 Dex) and then use the usual mods for attacks. YMMV.

 

[LordSkull]

I have very intelligent players, and my assumption is that the advantage of the gods-eye-view from above the tabletop counteracts any supposed favorable PC proficiency.

Was not questioning the intellect of your players. Was pointing out that the Character viewpoint is something semi foreign to most Players. How many of us live and die by 6s decisions IRL? Thus some of us need a little longer than 6s to figure out our moves. Although an experienced gamer usually has basic tactics already figured out long before the DM finishes describing the scene and the Intiative is finished rolling.

I take it your monsters use the same rules as the players? The gods eye view works both ways and is thus negated in my opinion. The DM and all his NPCs and Monsters have the same view as the players. So in a standard combat both are equal.

BTW not being argumentative just pointing out a different perspective.

 

[Ballard_Alvar]

There's no chance of mis-targeting an intersection.

That's how the area affected by a spread spell is determined.

Fireball is a burst, not a spread.

-Although it doesn't make a REAL difference in the argument,
this is what the srd says on burst. "Burst, Emanation, or Spread: Most spells that affect an area function as a burst, an emanation, or a spread. In each case, you select the spell’s point of origin and measure its effect from that point.

A burst spell affects whatever it catches in its area, even including creatures that you can’t see. It can’t affect creatures with total cover from its point of origin (in other words, its effects don’t extend around corners). The default shape for a burst effect is a sphere, but some burst spells are specifically described as cone-shaped. A burst’s area defines how far from the point of origin the spell’s effect extends. " So You designate the PoO and never miss (unless is a difficult shot)

 

[Chorn]

Fireball is a burst, not a spread.

You have that backwards. Fireball _is_ a spread. Gaseous type explosions are usually spreads while light bomb style energy blasts, such as holy smite, are bursts. Although there are exceptions such as the energy burst psionic power.

 

[Ballard_Alvar]

You have that backwards. Fireball _is_ a spread. Gaseous type explosions are usually spreads while light bomb style energy blasts, such as holy smite, are bursts. Although there are exceptions such as the energy burst psionic power.

I stand corrected. I was thinking of energy ball. my bad.(<I hate that phrase, but seemed appropriate)

 

[S'mon]

I have two players that if put under this Table Rule, would almost never act in combat. And, I can't imagine the DM being held to this, so isn't it a bit unfair to players?

I do this and I certainly hold myself to this; 6 seconds tops per NPC rather than for every NPC, though - if I'm running a group of mixed-class NPCs I need a few seconds per guy. If the players don't want to act in combat I won't make them, I'm not holding up the game for them either.

 

[Someone]

I as a DM have houserules against that kind of precicion placement, or at least try to discourage it. It has to do with suspension of disbelief. After all, the miniatures are only a way to remind everyone where every combatant is, not a replacement for imagination. That painted elf isn´t there like a chunk of lead, it´s ducking, moving right and left and generally trying not to be in a predictable place. He may lunge forward to strike, or backwards to dodge. Also, by the rules a fireball is a perfect sphere with clearly defined borders, but when one tries to imagine it, it just doesn´t fit the image of a fireball, does it? Doesn´t seem that a explosion has a limit of here, full damage - here, you´re totally safe. Of course, the rules must be simple enough so a combat takes a reasonable amount of time, thus the rules dictate that everyone moves in 5 fot incements and lies perfectly still after their turns, and balls of fire are perfectly spherical and homogeneous. IMO, placing fireballs that way implies that the "real" characters don´t move at all after their turns and fireballs are perfectly spherical and homogeneous, and it goes against the fun.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

Placing fireballs is the number one reason that I do not like grids in combat, and use inches and rulers instead, with the wizard's player guessing distance. If the player lack's confidence in his ability to guess ranges than I give him a DC10 level test with an Int modifier to be able to measure. (Yes, that means that hih level wizards can always measure, it is not an attack roll, just guessing range.)

If fireballing through a melee I do have the wizard make a ranged touch attack to hit the target area, otherwise it hits a target that is in the way. If there is at least an inch wide (five feet) line of sight then no roll is needed, and if he can fire above the melee and the path of the fireball does not actually clip an obstacle on the way, then again no roll is needed, just a good guess as to range. The 1 inch gap assumes moving targets, not doors etc.

I do generally allow medium sized casters to target over the heads of small creatures.

The Auld Grump

 

[kjenks]

I can see several tables I'll be avoiding in the future. Squares are part of the game, folks.