Altering subschools around for a new flavor- final version post #16

[Sadrik]

Arcane magic is consolidated into these schools:
Light: abjuration, divination and all light description spells
Temporalism: conjuration
Mentalism: illusion and enchantment
Alteration: transmutation
Shadow: necromancy and all darkness description spells
Elementalism: evocation

Subschool changes:
Illusion (shadow) spells are moved to Necromancy (shadow).
Illusion (glamour) spells are moved to Necromancy (glamour).
Illusion (Phantasm) spells are moved to Necromancy (phantasm).
Conjuration (healing) spells are moved to Abjuration (healing).
Conjuration (creation) spells without an elemental descriptor are moved to Transmutation (creation).
Conjuration (creation) spells with an elemental descriptor are moved to Evocation (creation) and these spells will offer SR checks to resist them.

 

[Sadrik]

No one wants to post how out of wack this is?

 

[CRGreathouse]

No one wants to post how out of wack this is?

Not really, it seems fine and there isn't much to say. Temporalism seems weak, though.

 

[Li Shenron]

No one wants to post how out of wack this is?

I don't see any problem with your changes

 

[Sadrik]

Not really, it seems fine and there isn't much to say. Temporalism seems weak, though.

Temporalism has conjuration (calling), conjuration (summoning), conjuration (teleportation), and any un-subtyped conjuration spells.

If you ask me I think it is still a pretty powerful school, those are pretty powerful subschools in it. But I tend to agree compared to the other ones they are not as powerful. Any suggestions?

Are there any other ones that are on the weaker or more powerful side?

 

[CRGreathouse]

Temporalism has conjuration (calling), conjuration (summoning), conjuration (teleportation), and any un-subtyped conjuration spells.

If you ask me I think it is still a pretty powerful school, those are pretty powerful subschools in it. But I tend to agree compared to the other ones they are not as powerful. Any suggestions?

Are there any other ones that are on the weaker or more powerful side?

First of all, let me say that your divisions are fine now. It's a little lopsided, but so is the core system.

Having said that, you're condensing schools, compressing 8 into 6. Light is fine (perhaps even strong), as are elementalism and alteration (since transmutation and evocation are strong schools). Shadow is fine, since it has necromancy and most of Illusion -- two weak schools that are good enough together. Mentalism is fairly weak, with enchantment and possibly a few others. Temporalism is conjuration (never a strong school, though stronger than either half of Shadow) after removing healing and creation.

 

[Sadrik]

First of all, let me say that your divisions are fine now. It's a little lopsided, but so is the core system.

Having said that, you're condensing schools, compressing 8 into 6.
Light is fine (perhaps even strong), as are elementalism and alteration (since transmutation and evocation are strong schools).
Shadow is fine, since it has necromancy and most of Illusion -- two weak schools that are good enough together.
Mentalism is fairly weak, with enchantment and possibly a few others.
Temporalism is conjuration (never a strong school, though stronger than either half of Shadow) after removing healing and creation.

Light: abjuration, divination, conjuration (healing) and all good, law and light descriptor spells
Mentalism: illusion (un-subtyped), illusion (figment), illusion (pattern), and enchantment
Alteration: transmutation, conjuration (non-damaging creation spells)
Shadow: necromancy, illusion (shadow), illusion (glamer), illusion (phantasm) and all chaos, darkness and evil descriptor spells
Elementalism: evocation, conjuration (damaging creation spells)
Temporalism: conjuration (un-subtyped), conjuration (teleportation), conjuration (calling), and conjuration (summoning)

I am trying to figure out what to do with Temporalism. Because looking through the Temporalism spells. A lot of them seem like they should be in other spell lists. I think I'll divvy them some of them up among the other 5 other magic types. An example: Summon Undead I those should obviously go into Shadow. I think I caught a lot of them with adding the evil and good descriptors to the shadow and light schools.

I agree CR, light does seem pretty strong and useful yet not too strong.

I was considering using this without any clerics and just use sorcerers and wizards. All the divine spells would be rolled into one gigantic list.

I have three ideas for how to run wizards:
(sorcerers will simply have access to any spell)

1. Wizards select 4 out of the 6 schools and that is it. Hmm...

2. What about this? I could have set wizard types:
Red Wizard: Elementalism, Temporalism (summoning and calling elemental only)
Black Wizard: Shadow, Temporalism (summoning and calling outer planar chaos and evil only)
White Wizard: Light, Temporalism (summoning and calling outer planar law and good only)
Green Wizard: Transmutation, Temporalism (summoning and calling nature oriented only)
Blue Wizard: Mentalism, Temporalism (teleportation)

This looks kinda familiar. (I added the colors after I realized what it looked like) I wasnt trying to get it to look like that but... it just came out that way.

3. To try and switch it off of that concept how about this:
Elementalist: Elementalism
Shadow Mage: Shadow
Light Bringer: Light
Transmuter: Transmutation
Mentalist: Mentalism
Temporalist: Temporalism

Then a wizard can select a feat to gain another magic school to add to there own. Every feat adds another school.

So which of the 3 is better?

 

[CRGreathouse]

So which of the 3 is better?

I like your third idea, but I'd do it differently. Allow wizards to cast spells outside their school, at reduced caster level, unless they take a feat. Of course you'll have to play around with the penalty to other schools (or bonus to the main school) depending on what you want to encourage -- mine would encourage Elementalists (those most needing caster level).

 

[Nifft]

I like it. Six schools of wizardry would be more like the six psionic disciplines, and thus easier to balance (with respect to Psionics, which I find very well balanced).

Some of the particulars should be different, I think -- like Light getting Law as well as Good is both too much and too restrictive (and mildly insulting to Chaos) -- but overall, it looks fine.

C, -- N

 

[Sadrik]

Light: abjuration, divination, conjuration (healing) and all good, law and light descriptor spells
Mentalism: illusion (un-subtyped), illusion (figment), illusion (pattern), and enchantment
Alteration: transmutation, conjuration (non-damaging creation spells)
Shadow: necromancy, illusion (shadow), illusion (glamer), illusion (phantasm) and all chaos, darkness and evil descriptor spells
Elementalism: evocation, conjuration (damaging creation spells)
Temporalism: conjuration (un-subtyped), conjuration (teleportation), conjuration (calling), and conjuration (summoning)

Elementalist: uses the Elementalism school
Flavor: selects one elemental type and all spells deal that type of damage. Choices: Hydromancer: water- cold, Pyromancer: fire- fire, Aeromancer air- lightning, and Geomancer: earth- bludgeoning. Can select a second elemental type by spending a feat.
Benefit: ER 5 or DR 5 against the damage type.

Shadowmancer: uses the Shadow school
Flavor: Shadow mages draw their power from channeling positive energy to them.
Benefit: Rebuke/Command undead by burning spell levels? Help with mechanics?

Luminomancer: uses the Light school
Flavor: Light Bringers draw their power from channeling positive energy to them.
Benefit: Turn/Destroy undead by burning spell levels? Help with mechanics?

Alchemist: uses the Alteration school
Flavor: Artificer's magic functions buy preparing their "potions, oils, unguents and charms" out of their alchemists kit for the day. They cast their spells by finding the right item and then applying it, drinking it, burning it, or breaking the charm. All rules apply as if they were normally "casting" the spell.
Benefit: Gains all of the craft magic item feats for free?????

Mentalist: uses the Mentalism school
Flavor: Psions draw their magic from their mind.
Benefit: Psions get Iron Will as a bonus feat?????

Temporalist: uses the Temporalism school
Flavor: Portal Masters create portals through which all of their magic functions.
Benefit: A portal master has access to a bag of holding at all times that only he can open and use.


Nifft, I gave chaos to Shadow. What particulars should be different?

CRG, reduced caster levels for different magic types? A little complex. What do you think of the new flavor thing? So, a mentalist who expands and takes another school, say elemental, would gain the flavor of an elementalist but not the benefit.