D&D 5E Alternate solution: Whack-a-mole healing

[Flamestrike]

Have an adjacent monster attack a downed PC.

After the first PC death, itll stop i assure you.

 

[Azuresun]

Sounds interesting, but in combat healing is very purposefully designed to not keep up with incoming damage (without spending significant resources such as a high level slot(s), magic items, etc). This is in part to prevent grindy combats that are dragged out by healing effectively doubling or tripling the amount of HP opponents have to burn through to dispose of adversaries.

That, and the more effective in-fight healing is, the more PC's are pushed towards being dull, optimal healbots.

 

[Greg Benage]

Is two weeks a necro? Hope not...

When I DMed 5e for the first time (I'd already been playing in a campaign), I really disliked whack-a-mole and implemented an exhaustion-at-zero house rule to "fix" it. Hated that even more.

As @Gadget @Azuresun and others have said, the system is designed so that you basically don't have to worry about hit points > 0, and this has a lot of advantages. It means players don't feel compelled to attempt healing all the damage coming in, which turns combat into an arithmetical slog. It puts hit points and spell slots in separate (though not completely distinct) resource buckets -- managing the party's hit points and managing spell slots during the adventuring day aren't of necessity the same problem. You don't need healbots (or ubiquitous wands of cure light wounds) and players are free to take other actions in combat that may be more enjoyable.

And really, there are no wound penalties, no death spiral, in D&D (feature not a bug), so this all seems appropriate. Hit points don't matter as long as you have some, so don't worry about them until they reach zero. Do other, cool stuff rather than adding back meaningless numbers that have been subtracted -- there will be time for that later.

So what's the problem? For me, the problem is characters literally being repeatedly knocked unconscious, standing back up and taking a swing, getting knocked unconscious again, etc., etc., ad absurdum. In other words, there's a little bit of crunch in the problem, but it's mostly fluff.

Solution: Change how you narrate and what happens mechanically at 0 hp. I'm doing incapacitated at 0 (no actions or reactions), stunned(1) if you fail a death save (incapacitated, can't move, speak falteringly), and unconscious if you fail a second death save.(2) Mechanically, it's still bad to be at 0 hp -- you're impaired and making death saves -- but you're not dropping, getting up, dropping, getting up, to the point you're yelling at the corner man to "Throw the damn towel!" Now the healers are just using that low-powered magic to keep you away from death's door and in the fight, rather than waking you from a coma every six seconds.

(Also, since players are evidently incapable of retreating until at least one character is at 0 hp, this at least allows the afflicted to move, prior to that first death save failure. He probably can't outrun an arrow (okay, he can't run at all), but at least he can try. He can stumble in the direction his comrades are fleeing and groan, "I'm not gonna make it! You gotta go on without me!")

(1) It's super weird to me that "stunned" is a worse condition than "incapacitated," but there you go.

(2) Yes, I've basically slid three simple "wound levels" in under the hit points. You just don't have to worry about the wound levels until 0 hp, and even then, there's no death spiral as long as there are spells like healing word to keep you in the fight.

 

[CleverNickName]

Have an adjacent monster attack a downed PC.

After the first PC death, itll stop i assure you.

I can vouch for this method.

 

[Asisreo]

I don't understand the disdain for in-combat healing. Its purposefully inefficient to disincentivize it so that healing takes place outside of combat and whole actions aren't being used to do anything besides doing what's fun for more people: contributing through Spiritual Weapon, buffs, etc.

Cure Wounds is more efficient than Healing Word without question. The only thing HW has against CW is that HW is easier to use in-combat, but slot-to-slot comparisons show that its better to wait until after combat then heal your party.

Plus, Life Clerics heal plenty HP during in-combat actions that anyone dedicated to being a healbot is more than welcome to actually dedicate themselves to it rather than wanting to be both the best damage dealer and the best healers in the game at the same time.

 

[tetrasodium]

I don't understand the disdain for in-combat healing. Its purposefully inefficient to disincentivize it so that healing takes place outside of combat and whole actions aren't being used to do anything besides doing what's fun for more people: contributing through Spiritual Weapon, buffs, etc.

Cure Wounds is more efficient than Healing Word without question. The only thing HW has against CW is that HW is easier to use in-combat, but slot-to-slot comparisons show that its better to wait until after combat then heal your party.

Plus, Life Clerics heal plenty HP during in-combat actions that anyone dedicated to being a healbot is more than welcome to actually dedicate themselves to it rather than wanting to be both the best damage dealer and the best healers in the game at the same time.

Healing word as a first level spell that heals 1d4+MOD plus whatever was absorbed beyond current hp by the inability to drop below zero is absurdly efficient. As long as it gets thrown out between a monster knocking Bob down and bob'a turn Bob doesn't even lose anything he was going to use... even the movement cost to stand only matters if Bob was going to run

 

[Helldritch]

Kill the downed PC with an adjacent foe if the foe is aware of the whack a mole. I usually allow one down before the foes realize that a downed PC might come back. Since I have started use this method, the whack a mole disappeared from my games. Spells like warding bond, heroism and cure wounds are actually used before and during combat. Most after combat healing is done through HD spending and Medical skills. Prayer of healing and song of rest are also used.

 

[Stalker0]

Solution: Change how you narrate and what happens mechanically at 0 hp. I'm doing incapacitated at 0 (no actions or reactions), stunned(1) if you fail a death save (incapacitated, can't move, speak falteringly), and unconscious if you fail a second death save.(2)

I think this is a fine idea for people who want more cinematics at 0 hp, and it gives some progression to the death saves which I like. That said, I don't think it stops the whack a mole problem at all, assuming healing still brings you completely out of it.

Ultimately incapacitated means you can move but you still can't contribute, so I'll still want to throw a healing word on you to "bring you back to full fighting strength".

 

[Greg Benage]

I think this is a fine idea for people who want more cinematics at 0 hp, and it gives some progression to the death saves which I like. That said, I don't think it stops the whack a mole problem at all, assuming healing still brings you completely out of it.

It doesn't solve the "problem" of PCs going in and out of death saves, and the party will certainly still want to pull you out of that condition. But as I said, for me, that isn't what puts the "problem" in the "whack-mole-problem." For me, it's literally the dropping unconscious and popping back up that is the problem. I like that you don't have to worry about hit points as long as you have some; it's the drop-and-pop that renders it completely absurd. To me.

I know there are players who believe the real problem is insufficient lethality. We've been in DotMM for two years and we've had 12 (permanent) PC deaths in a party of six, so I haven't found that to be a problem.

 

[Asisreo]

Healing word as a first level spell that heals 1d4+MOD plus whatever was absorbed beyond current hp by the inability to drop below zero is absurdly efficient. As long as it gets thrown out between a monster knocking Bob down and bob'a turn Bob doesn't even lose anything he was going to use... even the movement cost to stand only matters if Bob was going to run

Maybe in very low levels like levels 1-3 where your character should only be using these spells for very clutch moments, but when you're level 5+ you'll have enough spell slots to cast out-of-combat healing and still have the slots for emergency pick-ups.

But also, at these low levels, HP recovery is more valuable because the chances of your character instantly dying if left too low is higher. Its a swingier game and maybe 4HP isn't going to have the max 13HP fighter survive the Orc's 18 damage critical attack. Health is an extremely important buffer for very low levels and you don't want to skimp out on it unless it really is an emergency.