An Open Letter to Dragon and Dungeon Readers

[tetsujin28]

That said, I have an idea to save Polyhedron. Why don't you get rid of the fiction in Dragon and replace those pages with Polyhedron info?

Does anyone actually read the fiction in Dragon? I never read it. Its a waste of space. I would much rather have Polyhedron take up those pages.

Bad fiction is a Dragon tradition. It would be like, I dunno, covering other games or something to get rid of it.

Yep, I'm a grumpy old man *grumble grumble*

 

[EB3]

Too bad.

Dragon - not subscribing. Won't start.

Dungeon - Currently subscribing, and have been disappointed by poor recent Poly "content", general poor quality/non-useful dungeons, incedibly late shipping (i.e. its in stores LONG before I get the mailed version). I get the feeling that Paizo was intentionally hosing the Poly content (no facts, just a feeling). Considering the scope of D20, it is unbelievable that Polyhedron couldn't continue to find an audience - even if it just did adventures for existing WOTC D20 products (CoC, Wheel of Time, D20 Modern, etc).

Will cease subscribing. Why? The quality of dungeons are too variable. By my count, in the last year less than half the issues aren't worth buying for the adventure content alone. More pointedly, issues are in the stores before I get it (and I do NOT live on the Moon) - a REAL problem for a "publishing company."

 

[jwdh71]

Oh Well.... :-(

Well, there goes Dungeon for me, as the ONLY reason I picked it up at all was for Polyhedron. I haven't used a published adventure for D&D in 20 years, as most did not adapt well to my DM style, the world I run, or the style that my players prefer. The Polyhedron Mini-games gave me inspiration for side adventures to run, when we reached break points in our continuing campaign, and these little side adventures were always a lot of fun. I tend now to play more D20 than D&D, so the loss of D20 coverage is a double whammy. If in the future Paizo adds D20 coverage to one of its magazines, or adds a new one to cover the D20 world more completely, I will pick it up, but with this news I fear that both Paizo and my local game store (where I used to buy both Dragon and Dungeon/Polyhedron) are not going to be seeing my money for the near future.

 

[Mouseferatu]

Well, I had just decided to let my Dungeon subscription lapse before this announcement. But I have officially resubscribed.

I didn't have any problem with the notion of Polyhedron; it just very rarely appealed to me personally. I do play almost exclusively D&D (or at least fantasy D20), so very few of the mini-games provided me with much. The notion of replacing that space with DM-oriented articles appeals to me.

I do feel sorry for the Poly fans, and I was certainly not one of those calling for its removal. That said, I know that I'm happier (at least hypothetically) with the announced new format than the old.

On a related topc...

Since Paizo is launching a new run of Amazing Stories, surely the fiction in Dragon can go away? After all, AS is devoted largely to fiction. That would permit space in Dragon for either more D&D stuff or a single Ares-style article per issue covering something else in the D20 universe. I know that I, despite my fantasy-centric focus, wouldn't mind either.

I'd also like to second (third? fourth?) the call for more Open Content in Dragon and Dungeon. I'm not suggesting that Paizo release anything that's WotC's property, but surely it would do nobody any harm to allow the new feats/PrCs/monsters/races/core classes/spells/items into the stream of Open Game material? Given how long a specific issue is on the shelves, I can't imagine that doing so could possibly hurt sales. Sure, it won't boost sales much either, but it might boost them a little--and it would certainly provide for more goodwill in the industry, and when that can be done without harming the bottom line, it's never a bad thing.

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

Have I missed something? I think the Poly crowd in this thread have been pretty restrained, especially in the face of all the "I dance on Polyhedron's grave" posts.

I noticed this, too. I LOVED Star Wars Gamer. Great magazine that we lost...it was sad, but we got some content in Poly. Now we lose Poly...*sigh*

Part of my problem is people here seem to have screamed and raged so much from the Anti-Poly side that those of us on the other(who have been a bit quieter) just don't get any credit. I wonder how people would feel if this went the other way, and Dungeon was cancelled to let Poly live on its own...

 

[d20Dwarf]

I haven't bought an issue of Dragon in more than 20 years, and unfortunately, I don't see anything to make me change my mind. Too bad.

You say this as if it matters.

My point is that someone who hasn't bought an issue in 20 years (essentially has never bought an issue) isn't likely to start anytime soon anyway, unless something changes on *their* end, not with the magazine.

 

[Vigilance]

Since Paizo is launching a new run of Amazing Stories, surely the fiction in Dragon can go away? After all, AS is devoted largely to fiction. That would permit space in Dragon for either more D&D stuff or a single Ares-style article per issue covering something else in the D20 universe. I know that I, despite my fantasy-centric focus, wouldn't mind either.

Noooooooo surely that would elicit another round of whining, letter-writing, and all around gnashing of teeth. A *non fantasy article*?

Gasp.

Obvious those of us who appreciate different genres should respond like this crowd. I should have canceled my subscription and started posting daily, along with emails, the FIRST time Poly page count dropped.

 

[JeffB]

I wonder how people would feel if this went the other way, and Dungeon was cancelled to let Poly live on its own...

Well, I cancelled my sub when it went to "more poly" so AFAIC Dungeon was cancelled when the dungeons got leaner and fewer per issue.

That said I didn't mind the D20 content (other than the majority of the mini-games), but when it started to interfere with Dungeon content, it was time to vote w/ my $.

While I sympathize with the poly fans (or especially the SW Gamer fans, lovedthat mag), it seems Paizo is simply returning to the original focus of the what the magazine always has been about until a couple of years ago...D&D adventures. For that I'm thankful.

I don't think the anti-poly people are whiners, it's simply the fact that Dungeon went off on a tangent w/ Poly when the format had not changed since 1986 or whatever. You really cannot expect people to just say "OK...I'll take this other stuff I'll never use in exchange for material I will use in some capacity". And of course I suspect most of the big Poly fans were not fans of Dungeon previously. When the magazine shifted in thier (poly fans) favor, they were happy, but in the end Paizo only peed off the majority of fans the magazine had garnered for 15 years plus.

If I bought Field & Stream for however many years, and all of sudden half the page count each month was dedicated to mountain biking, I'd be a little peeved.

Not arguing mind you..just thinking out loud

 

[BryonD]

I noticed this, too. I LOVED Star Wars Gamer. Great magazine that we lost...it was sad, but we got some content in Poly. Now we lose Poly...*sigh*

Part of my problem is people here seem to have screamed and raged so much from the Anti-Poly side that those of us on the other(who have been a bit quieter) just don't get any credit. I wonder how people would feel if this went the other way, and Dungeon was cancelled to let Poly live on its own...

Now that several people have claimed this, I'll just chime in that it must be completely in the eye of the beholder.

Back when the pro-poly change was first annouced I said the same type things: "good luck to you all, but this isn't what I want so I will not buy."
The ranting and childish garbage spewed from the pro-poly side was plentiful.

I've never been anti-poly any more than I have been anti-good housekeeping. I just don't want to buy either. So I am not dancing on anyone's grave. I AM dancing in the recovery room because Dungeon just came out of a two year coma.

Lastly, the implication that this change is a result of louder voices is questionable. The reasoning clearly stated that the magazine LOST READERSHIP. If they were bringing in more money, they would keep doing it, regardless of who was screaming or how loud.

Poly may get to live on its own in the new version of ENWorld magazine. Best of luck to the effort.

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

Just a note, I don't mind the change on one end. I play D&D and make use of Dungeon and Dragon all the time. This just means more use for them in my D&D games.

Just dissapointed about losing Star Wars content...again.