Andy Collins: "Most Magic Items in D&D Are Awful"

[Ralts Bloodthorne]

Amazing. Congratulations. You win the intarwebz.

Amazing. Congratulations. You used a catch phrase from 1998.

Your mom must be proud.

Not as proud as if you got a job and moved out of the basement, but proud nonetheless.

 

[Ralts Bloodthorne]

!!!!!

If any of my D&D characters are blowing that kind of dough on glittery trinkets for saucy bints, they deserve to get their butts handed to them by the Great Red Dragon.

They're adventurers, for cripes, not foppish nobles who don't know the true value of a gp!

If a member of my party spent that on basically a free gift of herpes, I'd revoke his treasure privileges on the grounds of being a sodding twit with more sex drive then sense!

5,500 gp?! Why?!

Because they sold the last haul of jewelry they captured on their last adventure for gold?

I don't know.

Hey, 5,500 gp of jewelry isn't that much if your setting has some seriously exotic metals, some of which with inherent mystical properties.


I will admit, that's more from an Epic game, where dropping a couple grand on jewelry, or footman's livery, or new horses, is no big deal, and seen as part of having a noble title.

And while they may not be foppish nobles, showing up for a Grand Balle in bloody rags and dented armor isn't going to help in the diplomatic side of an Epic Game.

---EDIT----

I've gotta head home from the lab, so I'll firmly explain it later.

We're not talking Saduul Cortez buying jewelry, we're talking about a game where public appearance is just as important as combat ability. Where diplomacy ranks right up there with swordplay.

They actually hire lower level adventurers to handle some things, and take care of the big things themselves.

 

[Seeten]

Amazing. Congratulations. You used a catch phrase from 1998.

Your mom must be proud.

Not as proud as if you got a job and moved out of the basement, but proud nonetheless.

Wow, the personal attacks just keep coming.

So far you've proved you can throw insults around, and you've proved that you claim you can GM, and beyond throwing insults around and making wild statements, I see nothing else.

Come back when your ability is proven. Probably find a new set of insults, too. These ones arent doing the job.

Until then, you can spend the 20k on whores and ale, in the game you dont GM, and attack the BBEG with your folding boat, maybe the female guild head will come save you in your floating castle.

 

[I'm A Banana]

We're not talking Saduul Cortez buying jewelry, we're talking about a game where public appearance is just as important as combat ability. Where diplomacy ranks right up there with swordplay.

....right, because that's totally been what D&D has been about. Buying JEWELRY to look good at the QUEEN'S BALLROOM. So you can, you know, avoid going on adventures. Like a PANSY.

Nah, the game's about killing monsters and taking their stuff...and their stuff is used to kill MORE monsters. And sometimes there's a cool story attached, and sometimes the bard has such a high Diplomacy it doesn't matter if he shows up in his underpants with a ferret tied to his rumpus, he will win them over and start a new trend in the city.

Even a noble's outfit doesn't cost more than a few hundred gp. So whatever game you're talking about, I'm glad it ain't D&D.

 

[VirgilCaine]

I'm surprised that the big six is missing bags of holding or other such devices.

They seem to be amid the top three in my local gaming.

God, yes.

Heward's Handy Haversack, and a supply of 10' poles, 250' of rope, caltrops, alchemist's fire, lamp oil, clay jugs of water, and a climber's kit all go in it ASAP.

 

[Bagpuss]

Ditto for the game I play in. This makes for some _long_ intervals between adventures....

But unless you actually roleplay all that down time it actually makes no effective difference than walking into the town and picking it up from the first merchant you come across.

Time taken is rarely a useful balancing factor in RPGs since the players just say "Fine we wait until it is ready." To roleplay out that would be like roleplaying out every single day of a three month sea voyage to Farshore, after awhile of reporting on the weather and players going "are we there yet?" you just focus on the encounters that matters.

 

[MerricB]

That sounds perfectly reasonable to me.

Something reasonable in this thread? Isn't that against the law or something?

One thing I find interesting is whether "the Big Six" items are actually desirable to have in the game.

Let's have a look:

Magic Weapon
A key part of fantasy mythology. You can't really get rid of this one.

Magic Armour and Shield
Perhaps not a key part of fantasy mythology, but a key part of D&D play over the years. Getting rid of them might be desirable to keep ACs lower, but I wouldn't want to do it.

Ring of Protection
In earlier editions of D&D, assuming I recall correctly, rings of protection did not stack with magical bonuses to AC, and gave bonuses to saving throws. I'd prefer them not stacking, just to keep AC under control.

Cloak of Resistance
Cloaks have the saving throw function of the old Rings of Protection. What is different in 3e is how the difficulty of saving throws increases. These are fine.

Amulet of Natural Armour
Totally new. I don't really like them that much, as they continue with AC escalation.

Ability-score boosters
Increasing stats is fun. It's essential to 3e D&D. It's also massively problematic as their are so many things that depend on ability scores. I'd be tempted to remove them (or have only +2 versions) in a new edition. However...

Cheers!

 

[MerricB]

God, yes.

Heward's Handy Haversack, and a supply of 10' poles, 250' of rope, caltrops, alchemist's fire, lamp oil, clay jugs of water, and a climber's kit all go in it ASAP.

Read the next paragraph. The Bag of Holding is there. However, you buy one and forget about it... it's not where the bulk of your money is spent.

Cheers,
Merric

 

[hong]

But unless you actually roleplay all that down time it actually makes no effective difference than walking into the town and picking it up from the first merchant you come across.

It makes a difference if you're one of those who whinge about PCs going from incompetent to demigod in 6 weeks.

It also makes a difference if you're one of those who whinge about PCs being able to walk into a shop and buy anything they want. In particular, adventures might happen while you're waiting for your item to be finished.

The fact that real-time isn't expended is irrelevant, just as you don't bother playing out the 8 hours of rest that the wiz needs to prepare spells. It's a flavour thing, where you say "let's pretend that our characters, who exist only in our heads anyway, have to spend several weeks waiting for X to happen rather than having everything they want occur at the drop of a coin".

 

[VirgilCaine]

And now I have blackmail on the female guild head, or maybe just a patron to join the guild, or someone to advance my career and give me access to the "Vault of Deeper Secrets" so I can get a few scrolls in order to take on the BBEG.

That's amazing. 20,000gp spent in like six hours.
90% of people make less than that in ten lifetimes.

Most of it on Red Dragon Steaks. Which is a concept so inane I can hardly believe it.

And not-that-old-to-elves-Elven Wine.

Blackmail material? For 20,000 gp, I think a more...thrifty character could find a way to become the guild leader for 20,000 gp.

"A few scrolls"?
Of what, Wish? Spells no one has ever seen outside the "Vault of Deeper Secrets"?