Another Bull Rush question

[Hypersmurf]

"You use different moves fighting a crowd than you do just one person."

Strictly: "You use different moves when you're fighting half a dozen people than when you only have to be worried about one."



-Hyp.

 

[Rel]

Strictly: "You use different moves when you're fighting half a dozen people than when you only have to be worried about one."



-Hyp.

I knew that you'd be back with a direct quote. It's the same reason that you're the Rules guru around here. Specificity.

 

[Psimancer]

All good and interesting responses...

I thought about it a lot, and what I came up with was this:

If you bull rush an opponent and they end up adjacent to a wall, you may make a free unarmed attack that does not provoke an attack of opportunity, with a damage bonus (in addition to Str bonus) equal to +1 per 5’ the target was moved back.

 

[Saeviomagy]

As to the original question, I'd probably go with (for no good "Rules" reason) 1d6+1/5ft moved in Subdual damage.

Real, real bad idea.

I mean sure, if someone wall charges you, you won't like it.

Bear in mind that you're probably a 1st level peasant or thereabouts, and therefore you have 1-6 hitpoints.

Now - do you think it's likely that a shoulder charge into a wall will knock out most people most of the time?

I didn't think so.

I might adjudicate a single point of non lethal damage.

But certainly not the levels advocated here.

 

[Rel]

Now - do you think it's likely that a shoulder charge into a wall will knock out most people most of the time?

Um, yeah, actually I do. I'm not talking about getting into a row with some frat boy at a kegger who shoves me three feet into a sheet of drywall. I'm talking about an opponent who slams his shoulder into me hard enough that I am hurled back somewhere from 5 to 20 feet into a solid wall, very probably made of stone. I DO think that the average, unarmored, untrained commoner would stand a better than 50% chance of getting knocked unconscious.

He'd be lucky not to walk away with a skull fracture.

 

[Darklone]

Several points: Rel is right about being shoved into a wall or something. Many kicks in martial arts hurt the opponent by shoving him somewhere instead of hurting him with the kick itself (which would rather break some tiny bones in your foot than any of the much more stable bones in your opponents buddy). Same for throwing the opponent.

I seldom see Bull Rush used unless there is a chance to knock somebody off a cliff or into a river or some such.

I'm surprised. One of my barbarian chars loved to use Bull Rush to push an enemy along the line of my buddies with polearms and Combat Reflexes. Especially if you're not able to make full attack actions (or don't have multiple attacks), getting 4 AoOs for your buddies is better than bashing once yourself

 

[shilsen]

One of my barbarian chars loved to use Bull Rush to push an enemy along the line of my buddies with polearms and Combat Reflexes. Especially if you're not able to make full attack actions (or don't have multiple attacks), getting 4 AoOs for your buddies is better than bashing once yourself

Nice tactic. I'm curious - how often did that barbarian get whacked by an AoO meant for the other guy? I know a 25% probability of being unintentionally targeted isn't much, but it's still a decent chance.

 

[Li Shenron]

I think the free unarmed attack is a good idea, but I wouldn't give any bonus for the space moved. At most I could accept giving a small modifier based on the creature speed, but not on the actual distance (at least that sounds more reasonable to me...).

 

[Darklone]

Nice tactic. I'm curious - how often did that barbarian get whacked by an AoO meant for the other guy? I know a 25% probability of being unintentionally targeted isn't much, but it's still a decent chance.

Once in more than one year PBeM with at least weekly posting. (combats faster)

Did I mention that my DM hated my luck?

 

[Strahd_Von_Zarovich]

according to newton laws
it's like the victim of the bull rush is bull rushing the wall - like trying to force a door to open
the wall inflict you the same damage you are doing to the wall

Unless you play in a world without newton's laws.