Any news out of PAX East?

[Blackwarder]

Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't WotC said that they will start thr open playtest sometime in the spring? we are currently less than a month into spring so I don't understand what's all the fuss about, the open playtest haven't even started.

Warder

 

[YRUSirius]

Yup, dramaqueens just need to learn to be patient.

-YRUSirius

 

[Somebloke]

Agreed. Patience for all things, other than to get a full transcript for the seminar. Now, people!

 

[mkill]

Yeah, but how long do you really need to write a playtest?

For the 13th Age playtest I slapped together a conversion for a class that wasn't in there (can't say which). Took me two evenings, it got played today, and the player had a lot of fun with it. If I can write a class in 2 afternoons, how long would it take a Monte Cook or Mike Mearls to write one?

I guess the problem is that in a place like WotC the game has naturally be designed by committee, which takes forever and makes noone happy because for every really good inspired idea there is someone to shoot it down.

 

[Guest 85555]

Yeah, but how long do you really need to write a playtest?

For the 13th Age playtest I slapped together a conversion for a class that wasn't in there (can't say which). Took me two evenings, it got played today, and the player had a lot of fun with it. If I can write a class in 2 afternoons, how long would it take a Monte Cook or Mike Mearls to write one?

I guess the problem is that in a place like WotC the game has naturally be designed by committee, which takes forever and makes noone happy because for every really good inspired idea there is someone to shoot it down.

But the issue is they are not just throwing together a playtest, they are preparing the bones of the next edition to meet clear and challenging goals.

 

[Mercutio01]

It's not just a class thrown together for an already extant system. It's an entirely new system that is trying to hit all the wickets of previous editions combined. So yeah, I'd say that takes quite a bit longer than two evenings.

 

[BryonD]

I'm very glad they are taking their time.

Please WotC, blow the deadline if need be.
If anything, just STOP giving yourself deadlines.
Just do it and get it out GOOD.

(Not that I'm not really disappointed in the amount of new info we got this weekend.... )

 

[YRUSirius]

Yeah, but how long do you really need to write a playtest?

Long. Now sit still and wait.

-YRUSirius

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I really believe, they should look at Enworld and chose some new playtesters... leaving out those that constantly claim that they are doing everything wrong. I mean, how big is the possibility that those posters can be satisfied by anything.
Wizard does the right thing. They are not rushing anything. They exactly copy the announcements of blizzard. First test internally. Then announce a playtest. Then offer a polished playtest game. And if the are willing to modify as much as blizzard, then nothing bad can happen.

Also those people who claim, that 4e has a shorter lifespan than 3rd edition may also be proven wrong. This playtest pattern could as well go over more than a year. I expect 5e not before 2014.

 

[GM Dave]

I'm kind of surprised that they're serving up the same thing at PaxEast as they did at DDXP.

Supposedly they on a 4th iteration of their rules for in house playtesting.

The cost and time to set up a large playtest with NDA and everything means that they are blowing development dollars and squandering opportunities for fresh feed back.

I think one designer once posted that you need two to four fresh sets of eyes (never played in an earlier playtest version) to get meaningful data (I heard it in a podcast ~ Jennisodes ~ and I think it was either in connection to Apocalypse World or Burning Wheel).

Repeating a playtest of the same adventure with the same characters and same ruleset is only a publicity thing. A costly publicity thing including travel costs, set up, and lawyer threats of NDA (not to mention loss development time by the team making the trip who gained all this data three months in the past and need to be working with the current version).

WotC is not Blizzard.

Blizzard has a steady stream of people paying monthly fees for online video games. They have 10.3 million subscriptions (Nov 2011). If they collect $15 per subscription then they get roughly 150 mil a month for very little outlay (server maintenance, accounting, and some customer service).

WotC is more like a publishing house or magazine distribution business. A magazine that came out three months ago does not have the same sales as a brand new magazine. A hot author will create a buzz with a new book launch but often his other books quickly fade to budget discount at a target if they are lucky.

WotC announcement of 5e means that they are already in a process of decline for 4e. It is hard to get other authors to support a product that has been announced to be ending and it is hard to justify spending development dollars on something that you plan to sell for only a few months.

WotC which used to be strongly number 1 in the RPG industry has slipped to number 2. When you are in the number 2 spot a failure to deliver is viewed as a more serious problem. Investors don't like announcements that are not backed by delivery. This is not Kickstarter. This is a multimillion dollar investment gamble.

Is it worse to have a poor playtest or to miss a delivery date?

Personally, I'd choose having a playtest go poorly.

The word playtest gives you some insulation. People are going to flay you in blogs, boards, twitter, and media whether the product is finished or raw.

You are always going to get some critics that will condemn what you are working on. Give them a bag and let them vomit into it.

Look for what people like and what you are being told to improve.

The earlier you get this feedback the sooner you can avoid the trap of invested dollars forcing your decisions on to avoid a change that will cost hours of established work.

Revise and repeat the process.

Missing a delivery date is a serious problem. Investors and accountants do not forgive like the public that buys a product. The public will live with a few 'features' (like a system that is blazing hot to hold when only half way through a movie). Accountants only care that the cash flows when promised.

Hopefully, WotC can convince Hasbro that they are not in the 'toy' business and will be given enough of a leash to do proper playtesting and not publicity stunts.