D&D General Anyone else notice this?

[Gorg]

So I was thinking today... about how out of sync the games as designed seem to be with how people play.

TSR era D&D actively punished action oriented/ combat heavy play- but everyone played it like that. (And just ignored the punative/restrictive parts.)

Modern D&D mechanically is everything we could have asked for in those heady days of dungeon crawling, monster bashing, and hoard looting- in particular characters that can actually do things right out of the box, and have durability at low levels. But "Everyone" now seems to prefer the RP side of the game most of all.

Are the game designers THAT far out of the loop,

Or are we players just THAT contrary and ornery?? lol

 

[Steampunkette]

When the game was new, it came out of Wargaming. So the Wargaming instinct was paramount and that's the style of play people reached toward.

But the early developers had no giants whose shoulders they could stand on to make the more intricate combat.

Now, years later, we who stand on the shoulders of giants are making the mechanical gameplay that much more intricate...

But since RPGs have come a long way, there's a greater RP emphasis than ever. And it's -really- hard to write rules for RP!

 

[DrJawaPhD]

Modern D&D mechanically is everything we could have asked for in those heady days of dungeon crawling, monster bashing, and hoard looting- in particular characters that can actually do things right out of the box, and have durability at low levels. But "Everyone" now seems to prefer the RP side of the game most of all.

Not sure I agree that modern mechanics (as published by WotC) are what the old-school dungeon crawler players would've asked for. If this forum is any indication, they are absolutely NOT.

Also I disagree that modern mechanics are somehow out of sync with the way that RP has become more important. Personally I think they work very well and game designers have generally (though not always) done a great job at matching game mechanics to the modern style of DnD.

 

[mellored]

If this forum is any indication, they are absolutely NOT.

People don't go onto forums to agree.

Also, D&D is a creative game, played by creative people, who like to create their own rules and variations.

 

[darjr]

“Everyone” is a strong word. I’m not sure anyone can make the claim about everyone playing a particular way.

 

[Chaltab]

I think by now it's emphatically clear that a consensus of everyone has never been a thing. Even among old school players there was vast disagreement on the best practices in running the game.

 

[LuisCarlos17f]

I guess the reason may be because now the roleplayers are more focused into story because to kill bugs they can play videogames like Blizzards' Diablo. And the Storytelling System used in White Wolf's World of Darkness also could be a serious influence.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

TSR era D&D actively punished action oriented/ combat heavy play- but everyone played it like that.

No they didn't. Check out White Dwarf from that period if you won't take my word for it.

Lots of people were playing D&D lots of different ways, just like they do now.

 

[DragonLancer]

The modern versions of the game have to cover opportunities for all potential game styles and that is why it might feel out of touch. All the way back to 1st edition my games have always been more storytelling but without the excessive role-play. Locally we have a group that meets at my FLGS and their role-play is the defining element of their games. Sometimes it sounds like they should been strutting the boards doing Shakespeare. Likewise I've known players and other groups for who the optimisation and combat was dominant. The latter two don't interest me as a D&D fan at all. I'm in it for the story and narrative being told.

 

[EzekielRaiden]

Are the game designers THAT far out of the loop,

Or are we players just THAT contrary and ornery?? lol

¿Por qué no los dos?

More seriously....yeah, I do personally think there's a pretty big disconnect. Sometimes, you have an unpleasable fanbase. I don't think the D&D fanbase is unpleasable. Instead, I think they've learned the wrong lessons, and focused hard on things that weren't actually that productive, while ignoring other things that are or could be. But "wElL iT sOlD sO oBvIoUsLy tHeY'rE cOrReCt" is a powerful, powerful temptation--especially when that is actually manifesting as "well it sold, so obviously we're correct."

Hence why I bang the drum of Novice Levels and Incremental Advancements, why I go on and on about the importance of rigorous playtesting, etc.