Appeal of the defender?

[Nytmare]

"Just remember what ol' Jack Burton does when the earth quakes, the poison arrows fall from the sky, and the pillars of Heaven shake. Yeah, Jack Burton just looks that big old storm right in the eye and says, "Give me your best shot. I can take it."

"Who?"

 

[AtomicPope]

Very easy. Run a few games that end in TPK. Remark how they may have survived the encounter if they'd had a decent defender.

That.

Or have the party face a defender NPC supported by a group of schmoe monsters and watch them get pwned.

 

[Hammerhead]

"Who?"

Seriously? Jack Burton is from Big Trouble in Little China. A D&D movie if ever there was one, and a classic "B" movie.

 

[jackston2]

Now that I think about it, it's because of Anime. My players like Anime.

Anime protagonists are never defenders. They are always lean, wiry strikers or wizards. With inferior, muscular defender sidekicks.

While Western protagonists are defenders. With sneaky rogues and crafty wizards as sidekicks.

 

[Gloombunny]

Your players probably won't like paladins, but everything we've seen indicates that fighters will be damage-dealing powerhouses if you want them to be, equalling or even exceeding striker classes. Look at those DDXP pregen characters. The fighter does 3.5 less damage than the ranger using basic attacks. If she cleaves, it's only .5 less total damage. And that's a fighter built for defense, with a shield. Give her a two-handed weapon and she'd do even more.

The justiciar paragon path may be meatshieldy, but it's a paladin path. Look at the kensei path for fighters. Bonus to damage, bonus to attack rolls, and rerolling missed attacks. Seems pretty offense-oriented to me.

 

[AtomicPope]

If your players never try new classes then they're not growing.

What I do is I'll intentionally give the player that "tries on new shoes" bonus experience for "roleplaying and discovery." I always give an answer why and praise them at the end of the session (without being fawning or making it obvious that I'd like other players to try something new at least one every edition). Too many DM's feel guilty if they don't give out the same exp to all of the players - BS. Risk vs Reward. If someone is willing to break out of the chrysalis then let them, and the other players, know you're impressed by rewarding them with exp.

 

[Gloombunny]

Now that I think about it, it's because of Anime. My players like Anime.

Anime protagonists are never defenders. They are always lean, wiry strikers or wizards. With inferior, muscular defender sidekicks.

While Western protagonists are defenders. With sneaky rogues and crafty wizards as sidekicks.

Berserk is anime...

So the problem isn't defender classes per se, it's that they don't want to play guys with high Strength?

 

[Sojorn]

Berserk is anime...

So the problem isn't defender classes per se, it's that they don't want to play guys with high Strength?

Swordmage.

 

[AtomicPope]

Now that I think about it, it's because of Anime. My players like Anime.

Anime protagonists are never defenders. They are always lean, wiry strikers or wizards. With inferior, muscular defender sidekicks.

While Western protagonists are defenders. With sneaky rogues and crafty wizards as sidekicks.

Anime?


I really don't like anime. I read and speak Japanese, eat sushi, prepare sushi, don't like anime. It's a genre flooded with talentless hacks, weak characterization and storylines, and gratuitous sex and violence.

Let's not engage in homophobic comments, please, thanks.

--Dinkeldog/Moderator

 

[Campbell]

I'm not really sure what justicar nuke we are talking about.....my printout at least doesn't make any mention of his powers beyond a few innate abilities. But so far we haven't seen any defender powers that will save a striker who overextends himself and runs into the middle of a group of enemies.

We know about from a picture that HalWhitewyrm took at GTS.

Challenge the Unjust Justiciar Attack 20
Daily * Divine, Implement, Radiant
Standard action Close burst 10
Target: Each enemy in burst
Attack: Charisma vs. Will
Hit: 3d8 + Charisma modifier radiant damage, and the target is marked until the end of your next turn.
Miss: Half damage, and the target is marked until the end of your next turn.