Arcane Archers and the arrows they create

[orbitalfreak]

I'd say this:

At every level you get a +x to arrows, you also pick one special ability that you can substitute out. This ability would be limited to the plus of the AA ability. Choose the ability on your action, free action to change abilities, change once per round.

Total of 5 special abilities to be chosen, one each of +1 - +5, and you can take lower bonuses to fill higher slots. For the Epic AA, a bonus feat could be spent on acquiring a new special ability (plus of bonus limit would continue to increase at the rate of +1 per 2 levels.)

Good thing I saw this thread, now I'm gonna include it in my game.

 

[Kai Lord]

Re: Re: Arcane Archers and the arrows they create

That's way too powerful.

Even though the AA would still do less damage than an equal leveled character in any other Archer Prestige Class?

The Peerless Archer and Order of the Bow Initiate get to add up to 30 points of damage on a ranged sneak attack.

The Peerless Archer can add his entire BAB to damage.

The Deepwood Sniper gets to multiply his Criticals x5, and these are all at non-epic levels.

These archers get to make banked shots (OotBI), fire without provoking AoO (OotBI), make ranged Power Attacks (PA), Threaten (PA), and reroll if they miss hitting with an insane critical (DW).

Now picture those Archers with kick-ass Shocking/Flaming Burst Bane Bows and I guess I just don't see how enabling the AA to create SQ arrows on demand is in any way unbalancing, though I'd nevertheless be inclined to limit the SQ's to a chosen one per enhancement level.

 

[Roland Delacroix]

Sounds cool. Makes the AA a decent class again in light of all the other archer PrC's.

 

[Chun-tzu]

Re: Re: Re: Arcane Archers and the arrows they create

Even though the AA would still do less damage than an equal leveled character in any other Archer Prestige Class?

I guess I just don't see how enabling the AA to create SQ arrows on demand is in any way unbalancing, though I'd nevertheless be inclined to limit the SQ's to a chosen one per enhancement level.

I'm not convinced that an Arcane Archer would do significantly less damage than other archer types. The Arcane Archer IS getting a guaranteed +5 to damage PER arrow. I'm betting that there would be a significant number of battles where that bonus is higher than the Deepwood Sniper's extra critical damage.

But even if the Arcane Archer does less damage on average, I don't see that as a major problem. If the character were ineffective, I'd look for other ways to power it up than house ruling a change in his class abilities. And then I'd say, hey, maybe you should take one of the other archery PrCs instead.

 

[Kai Lord]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Arcane Archers and the arrows they create

I'm not convinced that an Arcane Archer would do significantly less damage than other archer types. The Arcane Archer IS getting a guaranteed +5 to damage PER arrow. I'm betting that there would be a significant number of battles where that bonus is higher than the Deepwood Sniper's extra critical damage.

But even if the Arcane Archer does less damage on average, I don't see that as a major problem. If the character were ineffective, I'd look for other ways to power it up than house ruling a change in his class abilities. And then I'd say, hey, maybe you should take one of the other archery PrCs instead.

I see it as primarily a flavor thing that doesn't inherently break The Spirit of the Rules (muahahaha), since SQ arrows have specific enhancement equivalents, which could be emulated by the AA's class ability.

In the rare situation where Archer PrC's aren't going to have sweet magical bows and arrows, the AA gets to shine through, for the rest of the time when the other Archer PrC's do have sweet magical bows and arrows, the AA's enhancement ability (even with Special Quality Substitution) becomes almost negligible, and then you're just left with what those archers can actually do with their nifty bows and arrows.

 

[Jondor_Battlehammer]

I think it would be cool to trade out the even level powers for different ones, especially if you ar a Sorcerer/AA.

I've also thought about bumping up the power of the Death Arrow a bit.

If you wanted these powers as add ons, you could just have the AA meet the same requirements he would need to make them. So to get a bane arrow, he would need to be an 8th level caster, have Summon Monster I, and the Craft Arms and Armor feat. He does essentially the same thing with his + Arrows, and it balances by the Feat/Spell selection required.

*Edit* He would need the spell available to cast, so either known as a Sorcerer or prepared as a Wizard.

 

[Chun-tzu]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Arcane Archers and the arrows they create

I see it as primarily a flavor thing that doesn't inherently break The Spirit of the Rules (muahahaha), since SQ arrows have specific enhancement equivalents, which could be emulated by the AA's class ability.

You said "Spirit of the Rules"! Doesn't that mean I win?

In the rare situation where Archer PrC's aren't going to have sweet magical bows and arrows, the AA gets to shine through, for the rest of the time when the other Archer PrC's do have sweet magical bows and arrows, the AA's enhancement ability (even with Special Quality Substitution) becomes almost negligible, and then you're just left with what those archers can actually do with their nifty bows and arrows.

I'm assuming that standard character wealth rules are in effect. So your Deepwood Sniper got some magic arrows. What did my Arcane Archer get instead? There's a whole thread about the cost of magic ammo. And not all parties have access to Greater Magic Weapon.

And there are at least some players out there playing Arcane Archers and they aren't complaining one bit about the damage they're doing. In other words, it's not evident that Arcane Archers need a free power-up (but if they pay a feat for it, that's fine).

 

[Crothian]

I think the idea of substituting other magical abilities for the pluses would make a very good feat and really do a good job of balancing this out.

 

[Kai Lord]

I think the idea of substituting other magical abilities for the pluses would make a very good feat and really do a good job of balancing this out.

Then its agreed. We'll call it Special Quality Substitution with Enhance Arrows as its Prereq. Then the "letter" of the rules for the AA doesn't change and we can all do a happy dance.

 

[Crothian]

Then its agreed. We'll call it Special Quality Substitution with Enhance Arrows as its Prereq. Then the "letter" of the rules for the AA doesn't change and we can all do a happy dance.

Sounds like a plan.