Arcane Trickster (3e) any good?

[Fundin Strongarm]

Felix, Decipher Script is an exclusive skill for Rogues. I can only use my Rogue levels to determine max ranks (3.0PH pg56).

BlackSilver, it's not the double points I'm worried about. And my DM has dicided not to houserule this change for me.

 

[Pielorinho]

You can still do it with three levels of rogue. Although you can only pump skill points each level into the skills available to you by the class level you're taking (i.e., when you take a level as a rogue, you can't put any skill points into scry), your max ranks in a skill are determined by your character level, not your class level.

Go rogue at first level, and take four ranks of decipher script. That's your maximum.

Take your next five levels as wizard.

At seventh level, take a level as rogue: now your max ranks in any skill that is a "class skill" for you (i.e., any skill that has EVER been a class skill for any class you've taken) is 10. Pump three of your skill points into rogue, and you're golden.

Eighth level gets you your +2d6 Sneak attack; ninth level starts you on the path to trickery.

My next character, already statted out and ready for the first Tuesday in September, is a Rog1/Necromancer3 well on her way to Arcane Trickster classhood. I'm looking forward to it a lot.

Daniel

 

[The Great Bear King]

I guess I also envisioned this character as being the arcane caster for the party. Needing to be a 5/4 Wiz/Rog will cut into that a bit too much I think. A 5/3/1 Wiz/Rog/Loremaster might be ok but it's too late for me to become a Loremaster.

I guess, if I had drawn out this character from the beginning, I'd have picked 5/1/1/2 Wiz/Rog/Assassin/Loremaster before going into Arcane Trickster, thereby only losing out on 2 levels of spell progression (but picking up an extra 1st level spell from the Assassin).

Anyways, I don't think I'm going to do it since I need to be a 4th level Rogue. Basically, I don't think the Rogue levels will help me that much during the transition and I'll basically be a weak Wizard.

What's your character's alingment any way, because assasins must be evil (usually).

 

[Talon5]

Unsure of something- one suggestion


You are concerned that stepping away from Wiz for 2 lvls that your group will be weakened in the magic area? That is my understanding.

Scrolls and such can help to fill in where your lacking. I realize that your 4 lvls from getting 4th lvl spells going the AT way, but the benifits look to out weigh the negitive here in the long run.

If you ask for some help from your group, let them know what your doing, and how much it will help the group in the end, they should go for it. They can pitch in for scrolls, wands and "stuff" to help you out.

Just a suggestion.

 

[Fundin Strongarm]

You can still do it with three levels of rogue. Although you can only pump skill points each level into the skills available to you by the class level you're taking (i.e., when you take a level as a rogue, you can't put any skill points into scry), your max ranks in a skill are determined by your character level, not your class level.

Go rogue at first level, and take four ranks of decipher script. That's your maximum.

Take your next five levels as wizard.

At seventh level, take a level as rogue: now your max ranks in any skill that is a "class skill" for you (i.e., any skill that has EVER been a class skill for any class you've taken) is 10. Pump three of your skill points into rogue, and you're golden.

Eighth level gets you your +2d6 Sneak attack; ninth level starts you on the path to trickery.

My next character, already statted out and ready for the first Tuesday in September, is a Rog1/Necromancer3 well on her way to Arcane Trickster classhood. I'm looking forward to it a lot.

Daniel

Again, since I'm playing 3.0 and, again, since Decipher Script is an exclusive skill to Rogues (and Bards) my Wizard levels do not count towards my max ranks. It right there in the 3.0 PH on page 56. The WotC FAQ for the Tomb and Blood splat book even mentions this. In 3.5 I agree that you only need 3 levels of Rogue as there are no exclusive skills.

Great Bear King -- my alignment in CG but if I'd thought of this build when I started I would've changed it.

Talon5 -- good idea but our party is pretty short on funds. Also, I'd be stepping away for 3 levels, not 2.

 

[Thanee]

Perhaps 7 ranks in Decipher Script? You don't need 4 Rogue levels to get the 7 max ranks, once you have it as a class skill, it is a class skill for all of your character levels... so you could be 5/1 Wiz/Rog and have 9 max ranks in Decipher Script. Yeah, you'd have to pump two skill points from the Wizard levels, but you don't need that 6th Rogue level to get the 7 ranks...

This is completely wrong.

A class skill is only a class skill for the class itself.

If you have a class, which has a skill as a class skill, and another which does not, your maximum rank is calculated as if it were a class skill, but the cost to increase it is still depending on whether it is a class skill for the class, which gives you the skill points you want to increase it with.

Also in 3.0 there were a few exclusive skills, which thankfully have been removed in 3.5, which could not be increased at all, unless they were a class skill for the class you just leveled up, and furthermore the maximum ranks in those skills would be calculated without considering any class levels in other classes, only those which have it on their class list.

So a Rogue 3 / Wizard 5 could have Decipher Script no higher than 6 ranks in 3.0.

However, you could be a Rogue 3 / Wizard 5 / Loremaster 1 / Arcane Trickster, I think.

Or Rogue 1 / Wizard 5 / Loremaster 2 / Assassin 1 / Arcane Trickster.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Felix]

This is completely wrong.
...the cost to increase it is still depending on whether it is a class skill for the class...

Right, which is what I said:

...Yeah, you'd have to pump two skill points from the Wizard levels...

Meaning you'd have to treat DS as a cross class skill when you put skill points in it from your Wizard levels. Kinda like you'd have to pump two skill points in from one Wizard level to gain one rank. It means the same thing. So "completely wrong" it ain't.

Also in 3.0 there were a few exclusive skills...

Yeah, forgot about those. Maybe not "completely right", so I guess it's a good thing I said "IDHMBWM", eh?

 

[Pielorinho]

Sorry for my wrong information; I didn't realize it worked that way in 3.0.

Daniel

 

[Fundin Strongarm]

Well, after a hiatus from this game when I ran my own game, we are back.

I decided to go for the AT and am now a 5/3 Wiz/Rog. I think that being the "thief" of the party is okay, not to mention a needed skillset we wouldn't otherwise have. The 1/6 (very soon to be 1/7) Monk/Necro has basically taken over the role of the arcane caster. I rely on him for my mage armor spell. I'm actually going to wait until I'm 6/4 before going into AT so I can get the extra saves and BAB of the Wizard (unless that is a totally stupid idea??).

(At first level I had decided to be an Evoker and dropped Conjuration. It was only later that I decided to get Rogue levels and skills. Now I realize I should've dropped a different school since I'll be in combat more than when I first conceived of the character. Like I said, with the Necro there, he buffs me with mage armour and I cast Cat's Grace on him so it's not so bad.)