Are people still mad about . . .

[ProfessorCirno]

Lots of stuff

They don't like 4e.

That's really not a big deal.

If you lost your friendship over that, all I can say is, wow.

That term if I recall was talking about the plans, salt and vaccum and a few others it touched on. Unfun was used a few times Skill checks and profession skill and out of combat skills being the ones I recall most. As I was told they were never used and an unfun drain on the game. So color my games unfun.

Yeah, one of the comments that really rankled me was something along the lines of "If you use craft or profession in your games, they must be really boring!"

Funny enough, almost immidiately after 4e came out, the one thing I saw most cry for homebrew was...craft rules

 

[M.L. Martin]

That term if I recall was talking about the plans, salt and vaccum and a few others it touched on. Unfun was used a few times Skill checks and profession skill and out of combat skills being the ones I recall most. As I was told they were never used and an unfun drain on the game. So color my games unfun.

I believe the precise quote is "When was the last time you saw a PC make a profession check that had a useful impact on the game? (Hint: If it was recently, your game is probably not as much fun as D&D should be.)"

Not the most felicitous phrasing, but I can see what they were getting at: By RAW shudder: ), profession checks weren't really useful for anything more than making money--so the skills either went largely unused, or if they were used, were probably a sign that the PCs needed something more interesting to do.

Are there groups that were able to make good use of them and weave them into an exciting game? Sure. But those groups were probably the exception, and were going beyond the rules--and groups that do that probably don't need official rules that much to start with.

 

[ProfessorCirno]

I believe the precise quote is "When was the last time you saw a PC make a profession check that had a useful impact on the game? (Hint: If it was recently, your game is probably not as much fun as D&D should be.)"

Not the most felicitous phrasing, but I can see what they were getting at: By RAW shudder: ), profession checks weren't really useful for anything more than making money--so the skills either went largely unused, or if they were used, were probably a sign that the PCs needed something more interesting to do.

Are there groups that were able to make good use of them and weave them into an exciting game? Sure. But those groups were probably the exception, and were going beyond the rules--and groups that do that probably don't need official rules that much to start with.

The problem is, they were still making a flat negative judgement about someone else's game. They were telling you: "Do you use this skill? Then your game sucks."

 

[Hunter In Darkness]

I believe the precise quote is "When was the last time you saw a PC make a profession check that had a useful impact on the game? (Hint: If it was recently, your game is probably not as much fun as D&D should be.)"

Translation :If you use profession your game is unfun"
Translation 2: If you use profession , your game must suck"

No your right that statement can't be taken wrong or as a negative comment on someones playstyle at all.

 

[Mistwell]

So if that one antithesis of fun. part is a big part of your play style or game then your game was just called the antithesis of fun as that horrible part that sucks the fun out of the game is a big part of your game. So is it a big jump that folks took it as "your game sucks"?

Wasn't the "antithesis of fun" comment made about the quasi-elemental plane of vacuum in 2e?

 

[Hunter In Darkness]

It could be, that wasn't my term y'all were using it. But I do recall it being said. Like I said before the Dev team needed fitted with muzzles and some spin control should have been brought into play at once.

 

[Mistwell]

That term if I recall was talking about the plans, salt and vaccum and a few others it touched on.

Pretty sure it was a snip at 2e, not 3e.

Unfun was used a few times Skill checks and profession skill and out of combat skills being the ones I recall most. As I was told they were never used and an unfun drain on the game. So color my games unfun.

No, not out of combat skills. Profession and craft were commented on (and I do not think those were the antithesis of fun comments). Was profession and craft really the basis of your campaign? I feel pretty confident in saying for 99% of people playing 3.x didn't think they were the basis of their campaigns, or even an important aspects. Those were relatively minor skills.

It's just they went out of the way to snip at 3.5 a game they just a month before were pushing books for as hard as they could, yet after 4e announcement it was garbage. Again they could have used some PR the dev team cost wotc and cost em alot, I think.

They never called it garbage. Again, what's with you and Shemeska adding stuff that was never said in order to make your point? It's fine you didn't like their marketing - I get that. It's not fine to misrepresent the things WOTC actually said to make your point. They didn't say you games suck, they didn't say your game was the antithesis of fun, and they didn't call 3.x garbage.

Some of what they said was interpreted to be a negative by some people at the time. In retrospect some people who thought it was negative have since gone back and read the things they thought were negative at the time and decided they had misinterpreted it. Others, like yourself, are still firmly of the belief it was negative.

That's fine, but I think given some people are changing their minds about it, it's good to stick to what was actually said so everyone has the information they need to decide if they still think it was negative or positive or whatever.

 

[booboo]

pissed I spent money on a game I ended up not liking (not the first time that happened)
happy that I'm now playing 1E-D&D

 

[Hunter In Darkness]

They did say my game was not as fun as it should be, they did call things I enjoy the antitheses of fun. And I never said they called it garbage, I said they acted like it was garbage

 

[Hunter In Darkness]

pissed I spent money on a game I ended up not liking (not the first time that happened)
happy that I'm now playing 1E-D&D

Ah yeah I have done that, GURPS was the worst. Still pissed over that one even if the books are very long gone