Areas of effect in 3 dimensions

[lukelightning]

How are people handling 3-dimensional space in regards to areas of effect for powers (yeah, I know, it should be volumes of effect...)?

For example, a scorching burst is a 3x3 square; does it become a 3x3x3 cube in 3 dimensions? Or a close burst 2; does it extend up and down from you 2 squares as well?

The RAW totally ignores these questions, which I find bothersome.

 

[Eldritch_Lord]

RAW has usually ignored 3D effects for the most part; climb and dive speed for flying characters and some spell areas were about it. I personally rule that square areas become cube areas in 3D--and you can "angle" them to hit a smaller area, so you don't have to align the cube with the grid.

 

[Syrsuro]

RAW has usually ignored 3D effects for the most part; climb and dive speed for flying characters and some spell areas were about it. I personally rule that square areas become cube areas in 3D--and you can "angle" them to hit a smaller area, so you don't have to align the cube with the grid.

I agree, for the most part, about the cubical nature. But if you allow them to 'angle' them to hit a smaller area does this mean that they can also change the size and shape of the 2d imprint (i.e. make their blast 3 some shape or size other than a strict blast 3). If so - that is a, afaik, a clear departure from the rules and if not, why only in 3d and not in 2d?

I'd rule that if a square is a grid-aligned square a cube is a grid-aligned cube.

Carl

 

[liberofurore]

You can't fly anymore, so why do you have this problem?

 

[mmaranda]

I believe it was indicated that bursts and blasts they should fill the space (if there isn't space for them they don't expand). Filling a space indicates it takes up three dimensions.

 

[Daniel D. Fox]

You can't fly anymore, so why do you have this problem?

To strike foes standing on ledges or hanging

To hit foes that are on higher ground above you (buildings, for instance)

To hit foes on barrels, or atop wagons...

 

[Syrsuro]

To strike foes standing on ledges or hanging

To hit foes that are on higher ground above you (buildings, for instance)

To hit foes on barrels, or atop wagons...

Not to mention the fact that even if YOU can't fly, your opponents may be able to.

Also flight is possible for the PCs, just not likely in the heroic tier.

Carl

 

[lukelightning]

You can't fly anymore, so why do you have this problem?

Nasty goblinses hiding on trees, undead casters on pillars, evil high priestesses doing their sinister dances on raised diases, all that fun stuff.

Sure, flight is hard for PCs, but terrain seems a lot more important, often at different heights.

 

[Tenniel]

How are people handling 3-dimensional space in....
The RAW totally ignores these questions, which I find bothersome.

There are rules for adjudicating 3D action. DMG p45 says (and I'm paraphrasing) when measuring to an elevated target you take the maximum of:
1) difference in height and
2) distance as measured on the horizontal plane (i.e. number of squares away on the battle mat) .

*If* you apply this distance measuring to areas *then* blasts are cubes.

If firecubes offend you, you can house-rule blasts and bursts are sphere or cones or whatever.

In 3e I generated 3D templates for area effects using the rules in the manuals. Problem was with players. They complained my templates did not agree with the official RPGA templates they had. Also the templates offered as guidelines in the 3.5 manuals did not agree with the ones I generated. I got tired of arguing my case, so I retired them. At ground zero, a fireball looked like

..xxxx..
.xxxxxx.
xxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxx
.xxxxxx.
..xxxx..

You can make these easily using a "monte carlo simulation" to determine if a square has more than 50% of its volume in the area of effect. Using the results yiou can generate a template for "ground zero- 5ft. altitude", "5ft. altitude-10 ft. altitude ", "10ft. altitude-15 ft. altitude " and so on. Essentianlly, 5 ft. thick horizontal slices through the fireball.

But (wah!) I have lost my code. But it is really simple you generate random (hence "mote carlo", you see... quite an approriate numerical method RPGers?) points in every 5x5x5 cube, check to see if each pont falls within the sphere (using good ol' Pythagoras' theorem) and after generating many of these work out what propotion fell within the sphere. If more than 50%, then the cube is in the area of effect. Easy peasy.

Here are the proportions of points at ground zero - 5ft. for a 20 ft. radius:
0.000‚0.126‚0.646‚0.911‚0.915‚0.647‚0.127‚0.000‚
0.132‚0.917‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚0.915‚0.128
0.646‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚0.652
0.911‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚0.914
0.915‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚0.916
0.651‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚0.639
0.131‚0.912‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚1.000‚0.918‚0.129
0.000‚0.128‚0.647‚0.918‚0.912‚0.649‚0.128‚0.000

So the 3.5e DMG template guideline did not precisely follow the text descrption

 

[Aristotle]

Fire Balls, not fire discs.. er.. yeah, I do everything in 3 dimensions in cases where a target, intended or not, is in an area that would be affected by the spell.