D&D 5E Asymmetrical stealth

[Charlaquin]

Here is a solution I am considering:

Multiple Characters attempting stealth: one check. Use the lowest proficiency. If more characters lack proficiency in stealth than have it, disadvantage.

If multiple perceiving characters: use highest bonus. If more are proficient at perception than not, apply advantage (or +5 if using passive perception).

Sent from my [device_name] using EN World mobile app

Yup, that’s the best way to handle it IMO. Two other people have made similar suggestions at this point.

 

[Ancalagon]

Sure, but still more reliable than individual Dexterity (Stealth) checks.

And that's the problem. Multiple dex (stealth) checks are *very hard*

Let's say that you have a team of 5 mid level heroes who are *all* stealth specialist. Each of them, through a combination of training, innate ability and in some case magic, have + 10 to stealth (in reality, some have a bit more some a bit less, but let's make the math easy). You have to concede that a level 5-6 team of heroes where the average stealth modifier is +10 is pretty freaking focused on stealth.

They are sneaking past guards who are fairly alert but not amazing (passive perception 14, which is not shabby for guards!). Each individual has an 80% chance of success... not guaranteed, but pretty good.

The group? The chance of success is 32.8%... so more than 2/3 of the time they will fail. So what is the point in focusing in stealth as a group?

 

[iserith]

And that's the problem. Multiple dex (stealth) checks are *very hard*

Let's say that you have a team of 5 mid level heroes who are *all* stealth specialist. Each of them, through a combination of training, innate ability and in some case magic, have + 10 to stealth (in reality, some have a bit more some a bit less, but let's make the math easy). You have to concede that a level 5-6 team of heroes where the average stealth modifier is +10 is pretty freaking focused on stealth.

They are sneaking past guards who are fairly alert but not amazing (passive perception 14, which is not shabby for guards!). Each individual has an 80% chance of success... not guaranteed, but pretty good.

The group? The chance of success is 32.8%... so more than 2/3 of the time they will fail. So what is the point in focusing in stealth as a group?

Because 32.8% of the time, you'll have a big advantage in the combat.

 

[GMMichael]

The group? The chance of success is 32.8%... so more than 2/3 of the time they will fail. So what is the point in focusing in stealth as a group?

Keyword is "group." Groups don't move stealthily. Individuals do. Each additional person trying to be sneaky is a 100% increase in your chances of being detected (give or take). So to OP...

When a gang of mobs is stalking my players, I usually roll one stealth check for all of them (if they’re all the same type.). But I just realized that when my part sneaks up on mobs, they each roll. This gives an advantage to the mobs. How do you handle this?

If a gang of mobs is stalking your players, the mobs get detected. It's that simple. One or two mobs...then make a roll.

Rolling for each PC is appropriate, and...accurate?

 

[fil512]

Thanks to everyone who contributed responses. The situation I was concerned about is 10 tribesmen stalking and ambushing the party. I’m not going to roll 10 stealth checks—that just seems dumb. I really like the Angry DM suggestion above of one dice roll, either best or worst depending. It really simplifies things! Thanks for the thoughtful responses everyone


Sent from my iPad using EN World

 

[FrogReaver]

Because 32.8% of the time, you'll have a big advantage in the combat.

But what if the goal wasn't to attack the guards but to sneak past them? Are you sure you want a party of very stealthy characters to have that low of a chance of sneaking past the guards?

 

[FrogReaver]

And that's the problem. Multiple dex (stealth) checks are *very hard*

Let's say that you have a team of 5 mid level heroes who are *all* stealth specialist. Each of them, through a combination of training, innate ability and in some case magic, have + 10 to stealth (in reality, some have a bit more some a bit less, but let's make the math easy). You have to concede that a level 5-6 team of heroes where the average stealth modifier is +10 is pretty freaking focused on stealth.

They are sneaking past guards who are fairly alert but not amazing (passive perception 14, which is not shabby for guards!). Each individual has an 80% chance of success... not guaranteed, but pretty good.

The group? The chance of success is 32.8%... so more than 2/3 of the time they will fail. So what is the point in focusing in stealth as a group?

Yep. Now imagine if 2 of those people in the party were bad at stealth. Only had a 30% chance of successs. Now we are at a 4.6% chance stealth.
Now imagine if 3 of those people in the party were bad at stealth. Only had a 30% chance of success. Now we are at a 1.7% chance of stealth.

I know surprise is a huge advantage but stealth isn't just for surprise. It's for sneaking past guards. It's for going unnoticed in a large crowd. It's for scouting the enemies operation out without being noticed.

I also know its typically boring for others if 1 guy stealths ahead on his own and they sit back from a safe location and watch for the next 15 minutes. It's also sucky if the stealthy guy wants to try and use his stealth and other players always try to come with him when doing so makes his chance of success drop to nearly nothing.

 

[FrogReaver]

Thanks to everyone who contributed responses. The situation I was concerned about is 10 tribesmen stalking and ambushing the party. I’m not going to roll 10 stealth checks—that just seems dumb. I really like the Angry DM suggestion above of one dice roll, either beat or worst depending. It really simplifies things! Thanks for the thoughtful responses everyone


Sent from my iPad using EN World

For monsters the worst is okay. For players, if you always use the worst stealth bonus its still better than having everyone roll. It's just that most any player that invested in stealth is going to feel pretty lousy that their bonus never comes up.

 

[FrogReaver]

Keyword is "group." Groups don't move stealthily. Individuals do. Each additional person trying to be sneaky is a 100% increase in your chances of being detected (give or take). So to OP...


If a gang of mobs is stalking your players, the mobs get detected. It's that simple. One or two mobs...then make a roll.

Rolling for each PC is appropriate, and...accurate?

Apparently you have never watched a movie!

 

[fil512]

For monsters the worst is okay. For players, if you always use the worst stealth bonus its still better than having everyone roll. It's just that most any player that invested in stealth is going to feel pretty lousy that their bonus never comes up.

All the more reason to encourage them to scout.


Sent from my iPad using EN World mobile app