D&D 5E At Higher Levels (Upcasting)

[the Jester]

I have thought for a long time that upcasting was an area with great untapped potential. By 'upcasting', of course, I mean the stuff some spells have listed under the "At Higher Levels" section.

I suspect that one concern the designers had about this was stepping on the toes of the sorcerers' metamagic feature. I don't want to do that, but I am very interested in expanding the upcasting options for everyone. What do y'all think are some good general options? I'd prefer things that apply reasonably to "all spells that meet requirements x, y, z" so you don't need to edit single spells in the book, just have a list of options.

 

[LordEntrails]

Damage, as written. Everything else is.... stepping on toes. Other effects, imo, are for things like class abilities and feats.

 

[Asisreo]

I have thought for a long time that upcasting was an area with great untapped potential. By 'upcasting', of course, I mean the stuff some spells have listed under the "At Higher Levels" section.

I suspect that one concern the designers had about this was stepping on the toes of the sorcerers' metamagic feature. I don't want to do that, but I am very interested in expanding the upcasting options for everyone. What do y'all think are some good general options? I'd prefer things that apply reasonably to "all spells that meet requirements x, y, z" so you don't need to edit single spells in the book, just have a list of options.

You've just made me realize:

Other editions have Metamagic available to all classes, and they'd provide effects like twinning or empowering. But in 5th edition, those metamagics are basically "inherent" to the spell.

So a wizard casting a 4th-level invisibility is practically using "metamagic" but they're doing it more expanded and with less overall options.

A Sorcerer can "stack" the metamagic so you have a 4th-level invisibility and extended duration so there's more time overall while still being "expanded."

I don't know, I just find it interesting. Oh, and this doesn't mean previous editions didn't have upcast spells, but perhaps upcasting was 5e's implicit universal metamagic.

 

[Blue]

Upcasting has been around for a while - there was a d20 Wheel of Time RPG that had it back in 2001. My favorite implementation is from 13th Age, a d20 that predates 5e in which every single spell being upcastable for all levels reasonably, and often with unique effects at certain levels, not just "add X dice". But the part that really makes it work is that they pair it with a caster having low level slots becoming high level slots, so the total number of slots is controlled yet you never have "wasted" low level slots. It's also got some 4e that spells can be daily, per encounter, or at will. Not surprising when the lead designer of 4e was half the design pair, the other being one of the lead designers of 3.0.

The SRD is freely available, if you want to take a look at how they scale every type of spell.

 

[Faolyn]

I think several spells could be upcast with extra abilities. As an example, Level Up gives alter self extra shapes when you upcast with a 5th-level slot: increased damage and a +2 bonus with attacks, the ability to sprout wings, or the ability to pose as undead. I can think of a few others as well, like tentacle limbs or general stretchiness.

I could also see some spells letting you forgo concentration if upcast high enough.

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

Upcasting AoE could have greater radius/larger lines or cones instead on more damage, as an option.
Or 1 Action single target damage spells could inflict ongoing damage when upcast (flamme strike, for example)
Support or single damage spells could target more than one target when upcasted.

 

[Kobold Stew]

As written, I think the two principal benefits of upcasting is (a) another die/level (e.g. cure wounds, lightning arrow), or (b) another target/level (e.g. invisibility). Magic missile, adding an extra 1d4+1 dart/level, sort of embraces both of these.) I like limiting it to just these -- each offering a linear progression -- and leaving any other amping for metamagic. (Disclaimer: I've not played a sorcerer in any real way, in part because I often don't want the metamagic effects; watering them down further would reduce the desire to play a sorcerer further.)

I do like the option for upcasting, though, in part because it removes the need to learn/memorize multiple spells: a scalable Cure Wounds is much more elegant design solution than one spell for Cure Minor Wounds and another for Cure Major Wounds. That does give flexibility to the caster, even with relatively limited numbers of spells prepared, etc.

 

[cbwjm]

These are some different effects for upcasting that exist already. No idea if this is all of them but I think that at least some could be used as generic options for upcasting.

• Increased radius (fog cloud).
• Increased duration (hunter’s mark, bestow curse)
  • Bestow curse also removes the concentration requirement when cast with a 5th level or higher slot.
• Increased targets (hold person, charm person)
• Increased damage (so many spells)
• Increased damage 2, more energy bolts (scorching ray, magic missile)
• More powerful/greater number of summons (conjure/summon spells)

 

[Shiroiken]

• Increased radius (fog cloud).
• Increased duration (hunter’s mark, bestow curse)
  • Bestow curse also removes the concentration requirement when cast with a 5th level or higher slot.

This is something I wish they'd expanded on. We don't necessarily need linear benefits, but being able to boost things would be pretty cool. Just as an example, being able to upcast Mage Armor to work on someone else would be really cool, if not necessarily powerful. I'm a huge fan of Concentration rules, but I could see a few spells being cast at higher levels without concentration.

 

[Asisreo]

My favorite upcast options are ones like Major Image where you can have them be permanent effects after using a 6th-level or higher slot. It really expands your options with those types of spells.