Author (and artist) of The Book of Erotic Fantasy

[mythusmage]

Since we're getting into allusion and simile here, I'd like to remind you all of these words from Tom Lehrer:

When correctly viewed,
Everything is lewd.
I can tell you things about Peter Pan,
Or the Wizard of Oz (there's a dirty old man!).

 

[Krug]

From ogrecave.com

Origins 2003 aftermath: the dirty details
Anthony Valterra showed me a 36-page-or-so preview of the upcoming 192-page Book of Erotic Fantasy. From that small sample, I can say that the book seems about 50% relatively lame fan service (a Command Orgasm/Masturbation spell, with color photo illustration. Did the world need that? I'm thinking not), and 50% fairly interesting, more sophisticated stuff. The prestige classes are where a lot of the interest is - Anthony told me that co-author Gwen Kestrel is very big on classes that interrelate (quite appropriate for a sex book). The Dominator and Submissive prestige classes have abilities that complement each other, for example. There's some sort of mage that can burn actual ability stats to achieve some effects, and s/he does well paired with a "sacred prostitute" class that restores ability scores. I asked if the sacred prostitute gave you 50 hit points if you got her alone in a van, but he didn't get it.

 

[Djeta Thernadier]

I think it sounds like a great idea. I heard about this a while ago and was very intrigued.

As for keeping it away from children, you can't childproof the world, even if you could, most high school kids are having sex anyways. You can sheild the kiddies from everything, they are still going to have natural urges and instincts. And for that matter, if these kids want to look at sexual stuff, it's abound on the internet and elsewhere.

It's not just kids who play D&D, anyways. There are plenty of adults. Those kids who DO play D&D , IMHO, tend to be smarter and less likely to engage in *reckless* sexual behavior than their non RPG counterparts. That's not based on any stats, just based on the kids I know who think D&D is cool. (I'm not a kid btw, I'm 26)

And this is not porn. It's erotic, but there is a big difference between erotic and pornographic, which I'm not going to get into here.

Thank you for posting Ms. Kestrel. You should be proud of your work and definately not be ashamed of it's erotic nature.

~Sheri

 

[Ghostwind]

I actually got to read the proof (as opposed to glancing through it) and, while the content is certainly of an adult nature, it is quite good. The images are essentially a strong PG-13/soft R rating, while the rules are balanced and the subject matter is treated with professionalism and seriousness. If the rest of the book is as good as the preview, it should be quite useful for gamers who are looking for a more adult level of play.

I was watching the reactions of people quite closely when Anthony was handing out his flyers and showing the proof. It was interesting to see the number of male gamers who seemed to want no part of it versus the number of female gamers who were quite excited at the idea of the book, especially when they learned the book was targeted at relationships, intimacy, pregnancy, and the like and not just sex.

 

[Edena_of_Neith]

I'm bumping this up.

 

[Iron_Chef]

I have no desire to control what you do in your own group. You can still DO it. We do not need a public set of rules for ertocia in DnD. This is simplely a move to create controversy in order to sell a product: DnD. And I do know that WOTC is involved. I know that you do not care how we, the players, appear to others. You're in it for the money, but I do wish that you'd considered that angle.

WRONG! You are desiring to control what others do in their group by attempting to restrict their access to this material which you personally find "dirty" and objectionable. Nor do you do know for a fact that WoTC has any part in this project or company, or you'd provide us with concrete evidence, not vague "gut" feelings.

The only thing that I can do is write Hasbo and WOTC and let them know what I think. In fact, I will be sending multiple letters, including a petition started by my players and circulating around the local game shops and universities. I did not fight the BoVD, but I will not go quietly into the darkness on this issue.

Dave Allen

It's "what about the children?" finger-pointing hysterics like you that are impeding the progress of society and ruining the fun for adults everywhere. You can't childproof the world. It's 100% a parental responsibility to restrict a child's access to "adult" material. You keep going down this path and you're headed into George Orwell's 1984, but you don't seem to care, let alone consider the consequences of your actions in the long run. How would you feel if this kind of "ban it!" hysteria were directed at something you had an interest in? You'd be outraged, just like your post outraged me.

You think violence is nothing to protest over, but freak out over sex, romance and nudity? That's so twisted as to be completely insane. Your letters will go straight in the trash, as neither WoTC nor Hasbro has anything to do with this project. Treating violence as acceptable, even desirable, while calling sex "dirty" is sending the wrong message. Sex is natural, enjoyable and isn't going away, no matter how much puritans like you might wish it to sweep it under the rug, whether due to your own twisted inadequacy or a desire to "protect the children" (which, IMO, is just a front for an entirely more sinister far right Christian pro-censorship agenda).

Personally, I think the book sounds rather lame (just like the GUCK and Nymphology were massive disappointments despite a few interesting tidbits), but I will vigorously defend the right of the authors and publisher to exercise their right to freedom of speech, rake in barrelfuls of cash from controversy, and I hope more adult themed RPG products will be published (preferably without juvenile "insta-orgasm" spells, complicated sex mechanics and magic dildos). The D&D game has been "dumbed down" enough thanks to Lorraine Williams and "Angry Mother Syndrome" and I refuse to let it slip back in that direction. I am an adult gamer and I want intelligent, mature gaming products.

 

[hunter1828]

This thread is almost two months old and I think eveyone knows by now that WotC is NOT involved with the Book of Erotic Fantasy.

hunter1828

 

[fusangite]

Well, thanks for posting the "details" of the preview for this book. I think I'll take the idea of the Dominator/rix and Submissive as prestige classes as my new example for pointing out how stupid prestige classes are as a concept.

D&D, more than any other RPG, is marketed to kids. And because of the structure of the open gaming license, the fact is that regardless of the legal realities, this book will be associated with WOTC and D&D. I think this book makes the case for modifying the open gaming license better than anything else could.

Those who wish to engage in the sex-violence comparison are really dealing with apples and oranges here. The fact is that every society has taboos against public sexual activity and no society has taboos against public violence. This is not because sex is worse than violence; it clearly isn't -- violence usually does more harm than good whereas sex does more good than harm. This, however, does not change the fact that being exogamous, monogamous creatures, public sex is something the vast majority of human beings are hard-wired against.

Obviously, this book has been written, is being vigorously promoted and nothing we can say here will stop its ultimate publication. That said, I think the book will have a net adverse effect on the gaming community for years to come. It's a shame Valterra and Kestrel are going ahead with it.

Why is this? Because the book will legitimate and facilitate graphic sexual depictions and sexualized play within D&D. I'm not suggesting that adolescent male gamers do not run games replete with sexual references, but one would have to be an idiot not to see that by creating gaming structures for sexual interaction and giving conferring the legitimacy on such interactions that the book does, the amount of sex in adolescent games will increase. Arguing that because teenagers already think about sex all the time, nothing we do will affect the ways they are sexual or the situations in which they are sexual is a spurious and invalid argument. How we make alcohol available and the contexts in which we do so helps to determine under what conditions and how much adolescents drink. How we make drugs available and the contexts in which we do so helps to determine under what conditions and how many drugs kids do. Surely, BOEF will affect how gamer kids deal with sex.

Why is that bad? I think that by increasing the amount of inflated erectile tissue under a gaming table over the course of an evening or afternoon, D&D is being harmed. Uncomfortable sexual dynamics will be created or increased between young DMs and players. The amount of proxy sexual interaction between players will also increase. This will harm D&D by:
(a) being more likely to present an uncomfortable, sexually-charged atmosphere to young female gamers entering a predominantly male group
(b) redirecting the sexual energies of young men away from creating real relationships with real people in favour of making believe they are having sex with their friends or acquaintances (Yahoo and AOL are already having this effect; let's not make it any worse than it's already getting)
(c) redefining gaming as a group sexual activity in the minds of adolescents, parents and educators
(d) causing gaming groups to break up when the sexual theme of the game erupts in sessions in embarassing and inappropriate ways
(e) changing D&D from a game that is transgressive in the minds of a small minority of religious fundamentalists into a game that is transgressive in the minds of significantly more people, many of whom are part of the cultural mainstream

It is important to distinguish between non-interactive sexual storytelling such as movies, books and comics and interactive, improvisational sexual activities. Public sexual interaction, whether real or by proxy is regarded in all societies as abnormal and special reserved either for the sacred sphere or condemned altogether. Thus, I want to make it clear that sex-based RPGs should not and cannot be compared to sexual stories and films; nor can it be compared to violent roleplay. It is a special case.

There will always be sex in games to one degree or another; the question is: will we as the gaming community work to see that this is redirected and limited or will we send young DMs the signal that they have written a successful adventure when all their players have erections?

 

[Iron_Chef]

will we send young DMs the signal that they have written a successful adventure when all their players have erections?

Gawd, I hope so. There's nothing better than Friday night spent smooching it up with some hot imaginary chainmail bikini babe and chopping off bad guy's heads all in the span of a few hours.

Seriously, you are not understanding that the book is for mature audiences and will be clearly labeled as such. Parents who allow their little gamers to purchase such a book without checking it first are BAD PARENTS. It is by this complete and utter deep-rooted psychological failure by people to accept responsibility for themselves as PARENTS that we continue to see these misguided pro-censorship "childproof the world" campaigns threaten everything that is fun in this world for us adults. This world is run by adults and should be enjoyed by adults. Kids are just along for the ride... It's solely the parent's job to "protect them." Not the author. Not the publisher. Not the corporation that owns the publisher. And certainly not the government. They can't even balance the budget; how are they supposed to do anything right?

I note you are from Canada, land of censorship. Canada has the most aggresive and restrictive censorship policies in the free world, wores than the notorious UK. All mail is routed to one destination for "inspection" where goose-steppin' customs goons can't wait to steal their citizen's money by jacking all their "objectionable" foreign products, like books and movies. Canada recently put a guy in jail in one of the worst travesties of justice ever committed (involving a conspiracy by the police and prosecutors) because the guy made videos with and for adults featuring naked girls undergoing simulated (CGI) gunshot wounds. Nothing you couldn't see in an R-rated movie, but Canada threw the guy in jail, bankrupted him trying to defend himself, and stole the copyrights to all his films in a settlement saying his life's work could never be released again or he'd go back to jail. Nice country you got there. The poor guy can't even move to America now because he's got a "criminal" record, so he's a virtual prisoner of the Canadian regime for the rest of his life, without ever having committed a crime. Lovely; the Nazis would be proud.

Your complacency and apparent endorsement of your corrupt political and judicial system is horrifying. What if they made gaming or one of your other hobbies illegal? Or your religion? Or your chosen career? You'd be next on their hit list and would have only yourself to blame when the jackboots kick in your door.

Canada is no friend to free speech, and your misguided opinions about what we can and cannot read in America are extremely dangerous. Freedom of speech is one of our most important rights here. You stick to your repressive Canada where the government does your thinking for you; I'll take the USA any day (even with the current administration, lol).

BLAME CANADA!

 

[tetsujin28]

The topic of the moment seems to be The Book of Erotic Fantasy.

Really? Never heard of it.