Avenger and Twin Strike question

[Turtlejay]

Yeah, but you're a *bard*. That's like starting with saying "First, we dip you in manure. . ."

You never get that stink off man, never.

Jay

 

[DarkLord Of DForce]

We'll, if he's criting on an 18-20, an avenger will crit 28% of the time, as stated by Iron Sky.

Now, with twin weapon fighting, that does become a 40% chance of getting one crit, and an 8% chance of getting 2 (for a total of a whopping 48% chance of critting). Again, as Iron Sky said.

Which really is pretty fantastic... making it a pretty good build no matter the strength of the avenger provided that the avenger hits the target with a roll of 18.

One needs to be a half-elf, though, which doesn't help the OP.

Incidentally, Darklord - any particular reason you want to go twin strike? Is if just for the gaming advantages of getting to reroll 2 attacks/round, or is there some additional reason?

Well, basically I was going for the crit fishing/extra damage. Right, the extra rolls and percentage increase for crits.

I was hoping the DMs would just let me switch to Half-Elf from Human but they won't. I don't know if you've seen some of my earlier posts in another threads about our DMs but we started out this campaign under 4e, and we were allowed to buy from the AV, up to our level, but not Artifacts or Wondrous Items, if we had the gold. Then, one item caused a total upset to one DMs plotline and they then cut the AV off from us totally - no magic shops in any town, no magic drops from encounters, etc, etc,. We've gotten nothing but gold and exp in the last 10 encounters or so. So we're stuck with what we've got right now. I've got a Craghammer, and was going to beg them to let me just get a throwing hammer for the 2nd melee item.

Point is, by the time we get to 11th/Paragon level, my choices are going to be very limited as far as options go. I can go Student of Caiphon or Radiant servant, to try to get my increased crit range, but I don't have, nor expect to be able to get, a Radiant weapon. I also won't be able to change weapons, so I can't go for Jagged on a sword or axe later on.

I was hoping that with Twin Strike, one of the PP paths like SOC or RS, and using Radiant/Fear powers, I could come up with some fair DPS via the increased chance of crits.

They ruled out the easiest path for me for that via Half-elf and versatile master though, thus my original post/questions.

I had taken the pains to write a great tie-in story too...and they even said it was "great!" but no, you can't switch.

 

[DarkLord Of DForce]

Oh, meant to put this in the other reply...

So I guess Ranger's Twin Strike by Paragon MC, as has been suggested as an alternative still creates its own problems because of my DMs.

With Paragon MC, I lose Student of Caiphon or Radiant Servant, so I lose their crit ranges, right?

and since our DMs are not giving us anything magical, nor letting us buy anything magical, I couldn't get something like Jagged for the crit range.

I'd be an Avenger/Ranger, with Twin Strike as an at-will, but no increased crit range.

<sigh>

Dang our DMs anyways.

 

[Nifft]

Yeah, but you're a *bard*.

Oi. 4e Bards are fine.

With Paragon MC, I lose Student of Caiphon or Radiant Servant, so I lose their crit ranges, right?

Yep.

You don't really need the DPR from crit-fishing, though, and many find it to be rather cheesy.

You can get good DPR with just Avenger (Fighter) + Pit Fighter, because adding Wisdom again makes everything hurt more, and you hit quite often. Also, as a Fighter, you'll gain access to daily powers like Quicksilver Stance or Dancing Defense, both of which give you more attacks per round.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Iron Sky]

What Nifft said. Your DM's playstyle seems somewhat limiting for optimization, so even if you did come up with some way to get twin-strike and an increased crit range, it sounds like they might force you to switch even if you did get it.

Pit Fighter works great with divine melee characters and they have some awesome stances: add Rain of Blows(I think that's the name) to Nifft's list, 1[W] damage against anything that stands next to you synergizes great with pursuit avengers and is awesome in general. I multiclassed fighter with my Stormwarden Ranger just for that power(and for its improved paragon version).

 

[Stalker0]

Oi. 4e Bards are fine.

correct. I mean...have you looked at bard rituals? My god the power!

 

[Turtlejay]

Bards are still tainted with the stink of earlier editions.

Sure, they may not suck anymore, but it's like. . . the Arizona Cardinals. They made it to the Super Bowl, but they are still *The Arizona Cardinals*

- FWIW I am an Arizonan and a Cardinals fan, so don't hurt me, please...

Jay

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

You can get good DPR with just Avenger (Fighter) + Pit Fighter, because adding Wisdom again makes everything hurt more, and you hit quite often. Also, as a Fighter, you'll gain access to daily powers like Quicksilver Stance or Dancing Defense, both of which give you more attacks per round.

You'll have a harder time using the encounter and daily attacks from Pit Fighter, but in all other ways it's pretty good, now that I think about it, especially since the DM rather controls how often your extra damage comes in as an avenger.

Warpriest is almost as good, the powers are a better fit and you still get your Extra Damage Action, and you'll have an easier time getting in (you can shaft Str), but it doesn't have the lovely +Wis damage on weapon attacks, and you don't get the extra armor. But it's still pretty good.

Brad

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Actually when reading this post i believe the DM has made the right decision to not allow your retraining to half elf. And maybe even made the right decision in shuttiong off AV.
He has however not been doing the right thing in not giving aout new magic items, because he is the one who choses them so he can not give out overpowered or gamebreaking weapons.

If you really want to have twin strike:

-retrain one feat to ranger multiclass at level 10, train adept power at lvl 10, at level 11 use your feat for novice and acolyte power and paragon multiclass into ranger.

Advantage of paragon multiclass over paragon path:

You can chose your powers. Those powers are often more powerful than paragon path powers. You can take the paragon multiclassing feats.

 

[Iron Sky]

Advantage of paragon multiclass over paragon path:

You can chose your powers. Those powers are often more powerful than paragon path powers. You can take the paragon multiclassing feats.

Disadvantage of paragon multiclass versus paragon path:

No path 11 and 16 features that are often what people get the paths for more than the powers themselves.