Background benefits?

[Dr_Ruminahui]

I allowed my players in my campaign to use the flames of war background, but I required them to choose one based solely on the "fluff" descritiption, without reading the mechanical effects. Which worked out well - the noble warlord has a noble background, the scholarly wizard an academic one, the ranger had the monster hunter one, the cleric has the wandering missionary, and the palldin has the criminal background one (he had a troubled youth - he's a very "born again" type character). In otherwords, I couldn't be happier on how their backgrounds compliment their characters.

This, of course, doesn't work if your players already know the mechanical effects or would ignore your request to limit their reading.

 

[Cyronax]

I allowed my players in my campaign to use the flames of war background, but I required them to choose one based solely on the "fluff" descritiption, without reading the mechanical effects. Which worked out well - the noble warlord has a noble background, the scholarly wizard an academic one, the ranger had the monster hunter one, the cleric has the wandering missionary, and the palldin has the criminal background one (he had a troubled youth - he's a very "born again" type character). In otherwords, I couldn't be happier on how their backgrounds compliment their characters.

This, of course, doesn't work if your players already know the mechanical effects or would ignore your request to limit their reading.

I really like that idea. It is a little hard to pull off if most players have DDI accounts, etc.

That said, it might be a fun way for the DM to reward creativity by asking players to come up with their own backgrounds, and then you could approximate a similar reward. They of course would only hope they get something cool.

It inspires creativity, rewards players, and inhibits powergaming. Good stuff.

C.I.D.

 

[DracoSuave]

Meh. The thing to concider: It's just hit points, and it doesn't scale with level that well. At -most- you'll get 5-9 extra hit points.

I think a lot of people are caught up on 3e design when 'Use X modifier for hitpoints' meant 2-4 hit points PER LEVEL rather than 2-4 hit points in total.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

The PHB2 style backgrounds work fine. What's really nice about them is that they ARE all mechanically pretty much equivalent. Since a character can pick pretty close to any number of background elements from a whole slew of books they are virtually assured of getting whatever mechanical bonus they want.

Sure you could just say "you get an extra language, an extra skill added to your skill list, or a +2 bonus to one skill." but attaching them to the backgrounds gives some hints and inspiration. The player says "hmmm, I want to be extra sneaky" and then they poke around and find an appropriate background that lets them do that. If they don't find one they like, then they can darn well just make one up!

If the backgrounds are bland in your game its not the fault of the backgrounds not having exciting mechanical bonuses. Its just a fault of nobody bothering to think about their background and customize it. They're a tool that players can use as a starting point, not the be-all and end-all on the subject.

What is annoying is when you have these FR/Dragon style backgrounds that 9 out of 10 players are convinced are the best things since sliced bread and as happened with the OP they all take the same one or two of them. It really doesn't matter if they actually are better or not. When they all give basically the same bonus though, then everyone gets that they are the same and it just becomes a little hook for the player during character creation to get them thinking.

 

[DracoSuave]

I just want to see if I have this clear.


Your answer to 'everyone takes this player option' is to make everything the same to another player option 'everyone' does not take.

Therefore, guaranteeing that everyone (as opposed to 'everyone') takes the same option.


If the problem is that 'everyone' is taking the same option, how does making everything the same solve that problem?

Is it a problem?

Or is this a matter of people -perceiving- something to be broken when, in fact, it's merely just good?

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

I just want to see if I have this clear.


Your answer to 'everyone takes this player option' is to make everything the same to another player option 'everyone' does not take.

Therefore, guaranteeing that everyone (as opposed to 'everyone') takes the same option.


If the problem is that 'everyone' is taking the same option, how does making everything the same solve that problem?

Is it a problem?

Or is this a matter of people -perceiving- something to be broken when, in fact, it's merely just good?

My point is that backgrounds exist for the purpose of fleshing out a character's background, not for purposes of min/maxing. So what is the point of making different backgrounds not equivalent?

The point of the background bonus is not to send the players shopping for the mechanically best one. Its to reward the players for bothering to pick one at all and then to give them some hints about which background might be cool and appropriate for their character, or even maybe they'll see something totally different from what they thought they wanted to do and make a more interesting character out of it. If they are going to min/max anyway, then at least divorce that from the story aspect of the background.

I don't really disagree with you that most of the backgrounds are pretty close to the same in terms of utility. Your argument about Born Under a Bad Sign is perfectly good. Its just why even create the situation where this whole question arises in the first place? Its not necessary. Sticking to PHB2 style background bonuses solves the problem and in no way negatively affects the utility of the background system, IMHO.

 

[Garthanos]

Recently I built Zorro. The "political rebel" background from SoWAP just plain worked.

I considered mechanically using a sword and main gauche or whip in offhand
wielding ranger, with dos pistolles(sp) for ranged fighting....
his nature skills being for horsemanship and desert survival of course.

Getting access to both diplomacy and streetwise with a touch of boost because his charisma might not have been so awesome with the above build might have been .... vital.

I did end up building him as a rogue so mechanically I "needed" only access to Diplomacy and a general background gaining him access might have worked fine.. and some of the new duelist powers and feats worked awesome (anyone feel like DMing mythic early America?).

Did I mention I like the backgrounds with bite? I like in general ones that open up my design options.... like Windrise Ports or ones that provide something that feels "unusual" like resistances from Akanul.

And usually like most things 4e - I take the mechanics and reflavor (no re-fluffing here)
The resistances from Akanul might be because the character was born in a magical storm of many elements which he absorbed ... I might pick the language primordial and say he knows it not because of any sort of normal training but rather it was imprinted on his mind during that storm and only later did anyone know what he was speaking and yeah multiclass sorceror or warlock maybe

shrug, in the FR/SoWAP backgrounds have a lot of things which spark me depending on the character I am building.

I am considering a house rule letting anyone pick any skill independent of class / the skills you pick are one of the ways you define your characters story... not sure a resource need be expended to allow somebody the freedom to choose that.(and yeah even the choice of a background is a design resource)

 

[eamon]

Its to reward the players for bothering to pick one at all and then to give them some hints about which background might be cool and appropriate for their character, or even maybe they'll see something totally different from what they thought they wanted to do and make a more interesting character out of it.

See, this is a bad idea, I think.

Most people have a reasonable idea of what they're building by the time they pick a background. They'll have chosen a race and a class, possibly chosen a name and even mostly settled on what the character can do - the weapons he wields, etc. When you're chosing a background people may already have a rough idea of what they want. If all the backgrounds merely grant a class skill or a +2 bonus, then this step devolves into "hey, this character wants bluff - but he's a wizard, hmm, let's see" and picking whatever possibly inappropriate background.

The backgrounds as the PHB2 presents them don't inspire any ideas, they're just a way to distribute skills a little more flexibly. Their monotony rejects the notion of actually browsing through these things for anything but mechanical benefit. And, suddenly, if you think you've found a background that seems fitting roleplaying wise but whose associated skills just don't mesh, you're kinda pushed into "selecting" another background. And it's quite clear many of these backgrounds are quite amusing, but the one or two associated skills only vaguely cover the flavor.

I think the associated language benefit works for regional backgrounds. Predefined associated skills are almost certainly nonsense. Fortunately it's usually not a big issue since your class probably covers most of them - but that doesn't mean I like the mechanic at all.

Backgrounds should either be at least interesting enough to browse - or they shouldn't limit selection of associated skills. Don't impose non-sensical roleplaying backgrounds on skill choices, which is what PHB2 backgrounds effectively do: instead, let people pick a background and choose an associated skill themselves - or make sure the backgrounds' benefits are varied enough to be interesting.

 

[Jhaelen]

The backgrounds as the PHB2 presents them don't inspire any ideas, they're just a way to distribute skills a little more flexibly.

And this has not been my experience. They DID inspire my players. Supportive fact: Some of them forgot to pick any benefit for the backgrounds they selected.

I.e. they're a good idea even if they didn't provide any mechanical bonus at all.

 

[Garthanos]

Most people have a reasonable idea of what they're building by the time they pick a background. .

Character design is not nailed down to any particular order... I like to start with a concept then try to find the mechanics which best fit that.

but not always...

Sometimes I dabble with a bit of hardware like I described above with the FR background which granted resistances and let that inspire some concept idea.

If the hardware is both bland and weak I find it a whole lot less useful.

It may still be all I need to get where I am going but it will be uninspiring.... which is probably the worse thing that can be said about my idea for a house rule allowing folk to pick any skills they want.