Barbarian - likes and dislikes?

[RichGreen]

Hi,

I'm playing a Totem Rager from Magic of Incarnum with 4 levels of barbarian at the moment which is great fun. I like raging, d12 hit dice and the ability to do lots of damage with Power Attack/greataxe. I dislike the lack of Spot as a class skill, but everything else seems fine.

Cheers


Richard

 

[Bront]

In general, I like the overall flavor of the barbarian, though addmittedly it's not the only way to go (There are plenty of barbarian rangers). I like that there are benifits of going 20 levels of Barb (I think all classes should reward staying in class, particularly with more than just more spells or ability uses). I like the skill selection specificly, and the 4 skill points.

I don't care for the illiteracy, but that's minor.

I don't like how the class is ripe for cherry picking. As you can easily drop out of it after 1st level, and get Rage, which is a very powerful ability. (Compare to the bonus feat and armor proficiency of the Fighter, and that's not including the lower HD, or fewer skill points as well). I'm not sure I care for the medium armor proficiency either (Hide? Sure, but it's inferior to a Chain Shirt, and all the other armor doesn't fit the flavor.)

Honestly, I guess when it comes down to it, I don't care for Rage as a low level ability.

 

[glass]

Dislike: Rage

I see humans (or whatever) from primitive or barbaric tribes being hardier than there more civilised counterparts, not angrier. The d12 HD fits perfectly IMO, as does the fast movement, but rage would be better replaced with smaller, but premanent, boosts to Str and/or Con.

Rage should be a feat chain, IMO. It would of course be an excellent choice for barbarians, but not their only choice.


glass.

 

[Aus_Snow]

Should be: Berserker, rather than a legacy name that just doesn't cut it anymore.

Like: Rage, fast movement, d12 HD, good BAB and Fort save, uncanny dodge (& improved), martial weapons, medium armour, 4+Int skp.

Shouldn't have: Trap sense, illiteracy (all characters should be illiterate by default, with options for literacy *per language* via skills, feats, whatever), alignment restriction.

Should have: Spot as a class skill, Diehard or something like it, and possibly other similar abilities.


edit --- regarding literacy, that should've been "all characters *except Wizards and Clerics* (and possibly members of specific other classes) should be illiterate by default [. . .]"

 

[Land Outcast]

Rage should be a feat chain, IMO. It would of course be an excellent choice for barbarians, but not their only choice.

That'd be similar to the Ranger's combat styles, right?
I can see it:

Lvl 1:
Battle Trance or
Battledance or
Flurry or
Rage or
Throwing Flurry or
Whirling Frenzy

Lvl 6: -An extra ability, could simply be a sensible modification of the Rage feats or other, like for the Throwing Flurry being able to apply Str instead of Dex when attacking with thrown weapons-

Lvl 11: Greater [insert first level choice here]

Lvl 17: Exploding or Tireless [insert first level choice here]. The "Exploding" option would be optional to use, and would last half as much as the ordinary rage, giving greater benefits. Your Rage's duration is not modified by the Extended Rage or similar effects when you choose to enter an Explosive Rage.

Lvl 20: Mighty [insert first level choice here]

-enough of a hijack-

 

[Old Fart]

Others have mentioned class name and illiteracy. They are holdovers from the original class as presented in 1st ed Unearthed Arcana, which was itself designed to appeal to Conan fans. IMHO, the class is still inspired/derived from R.E. Howard more than Norse, American Indian, or any other historical culture.

That being said, I actually like the class name, as it gives a easily identifyable "hook" into the character concept to new players, for which it is also a good choice of class to play. While I understand the objections to the cultural implications of the name, it's really no less culturally bound/inaccurate than cleric, druid, bard, paladin, etc.

As for illiteracy, any player that feels this is counter to their character's concept can eliminate it for two skill points.

Mechanically, I like that the class takes a fighting "style" and builds upon it through 20th level. I dislike that rage and fast movement are 1st-level abilities, which makes "dipping into" 1st level barbarian an all-too-common occurance. The conversion from 3.0 to 3.5 fixed this issue for rangers; I can't believe barbarian was not addressed as well.

What I would I improve/change:
1) Other than the whirling dervish barbarian option, every one I've seen in play had Power Attack. When virtually every member of the class has a feat, it may as well be one of the class abilities.
2) The trap sense should be expanded to be a flat bonus to AC. This would compensate for the low-AC issues of the class. Something similar to the AC bonuses of the swashbuckler, duelist, et. al; and limited to certain armor types/encumbrance level as are those abilities.
3) Add Spot to the list of class skills.
4) Move rage or fast move to 2nd level or higher to discourage "class dipping."

 

[mmu1]

I like the overall class design, the good (for a "pure" fighting class) skill selection and skill points, and love the fast movement.

I dislike some aspects of the rage mechanic - the Con increase, specifically, because of its potential to create (especially at higher levels) a situation where, after a big fight, everyone runs around like a chicken with its head cut off, trying to scrounge up enough healing to make sure the Barbarian doesn't instantly go to -30 HP when his Rage ends. I think the -2 to AC is punishing enough, anyway, and usually means you lose a lot more extra HP than you gain from Raging.

I've house-ruled it a while ago for my games so that Rage stays as is, except it grants a DR/- slowly increasing with level instead of the +4 Con.

Finally, my favorite Barbarian build has to be a Dwarven one - very tough vs. spells, and can wear medium armor and still benefit fully from fast movement.

 

[Greg K]

I lke it now that we have the barbarian hunter variant from UA. For even more variation, use the UA weapon groups, but create cultural based groups.

 

[ForceUser]

For those of you grousing about the name of the class, you do realize that you can just call it whatever you want, right? For instance, I'm not a fan of the name "duskblade," so in my campaign I'm calling the class spellsword (I don't use the PrC). I mean, seriously--what's in a name? A rose by any other name would smell as sweet.

 

[FalcWP]

I don't know many barbarians by *any* name that smell like roses.