D&D General Best Adventure Path (spanning 10+ levels) of all time?

[Frankie1969]

Large but straightforward question: what is the best collection of pre-made adventure content that follows a full story arc from small-time local heroes (preferably starting at level 1, no higher than 4) to world-hopping legends (preferably reaching 20, no lower than 14)?

Not just in 5E. Any edition, including 4E, PF, 13A, or any other system similar enough to translate.

YMMV, but my personal criteria for "best" are:

1. well-written plot with logical motivation & consequences,
2. well-written NPCs who merit emotional investment,
3. well-written scenarios, preferably organized like instructions not like a novella,
4. well-balanced & interesting challenges, and
5. not overly complex to DM (Zeitgeist gets dinged on this last point).

I don't know what my answer would be. I have fond memories of (TA)GDQ but I know it doesn't stand up well by modern standards.

 

[Steel_Wind]

The correct answer is Rise of the Runelords. Why? Because these people wrote it, while being guided by James Jacobs, who is the best architect/developer of adventures in the RPG business:

James Jacobs, Richard Pett, Nicolas Logue, Wolfgang Baur, Stephen S. Greer, Greg A. Vaughan. You can maybe quibble about Stephen Greer in the HoF and replace him with Tim Hitchcock for your 6 Hall of Famers, but there are lots who will say "keep him in".

That's why RotRL is the best. You can run it in 3.5, PF1, or convert it to PF2 or 5e (it's pretty easy to convert this; really go try it!). It's still the best AP overall where the authors were each doing their DAMNDEST to save Paizo as a company -- what they thought of as "saving the spirit of Dungeon Magazine" at the time. They pulled out all the stops and it shows.

And save it they did, too. The thing about RotRL which sets it off from other APs so clearly is that "the back nine" is as strong "as the front nine" -- THAT is why it is the best.

Typically, APs tend to be really good in the first 3 volumes( or half), and tail off significantly in the second half. Kingmaker suffers from this. Kingmaker is spectacular in Vols 1-3, but the back nine... it tails off too much in quality and pacing; it often feels like a different adventure entirely. The BBEG in Vol 6, in particular, was not telegraphed properly and essentially comes out of nowhere. The re-written Kingmaker for PF2/5e addresses this - or tries to. The back nine is still perceptibly weak in Kingmaker though.

The inconsistency in the 2 Dungeon APs (Shackled City doesn't even count as a true AP as it was written with a very different method) is the reason neither qualifies as coming even close to the podium overall. They are all over the place in quality, and all have "disappointing back nines" in terms of quality. The main reason for this is that WotC interfered with Paizo's design decisions on the Dungeon APs and refused to let Paizo make significant story awards for XP points to escape the grind, such that each of these APs are grindy AF.

I do love The Whispering Cairn and think it is one of the best 3.5 module released considered on its own (Red Hand of Doom is almost as good and a far longer module though which maybe presents more of a challenge?) Still, by the time you get to Chapter 8? AoW goes off the rails and descends in to ceaseless hack and slash. ( I have run AoW twice - once under 3.5 and the other under PF1). I only ran Savage Tide once - that was more than enough, thanks.

Nothing for PF2 has stood out yet to the same degree. Vol 1 of Abomination Vaults, by James Jacobs of course, is outstanding and a call back to what our altered perception (distorted by nostalgia) likes to think 1st ed was at its best. (In truth, 1st ed dungeon crawls was never as good as AV1 is). The problem is that Vol 2 of this 3 volume AP is weak and needs work to make it a worthy sequel to the excellent Vol 1. It's fixable, but really, I shouldn't have to do that.

1st Ed - It's DragonLance DL1-14 and it's not even close. It was the first true AP, though some of the things it did we have decided to not do again. That doesn't change the fact that much of what it did changed adventures and adventure writing forever. There is a reason we keep talking about this damned module series, nearly 40 years later.
2nd Ed - Weak edition in the epic adventure department. I think people were still mainly running 1st ed modules at the time, tbh. Night Below and Rod of Seven Parts I guess would be the nominees but those are both .. iffy long format adventures, at best.
3rd - Rise of the Runelords
PF1 - Rise of the Runelords Anniv Ed. Curse of the Crimson Throne Anniv Ed comes close though -- Why? Once again, it also has a "strong back nine".
5e - Likely Curse of Strahd. You might go with Rime of the Frostmaiden, but both of these require far too much DM prep work and alteration to work properly out of the box. WotC can't be bothered to finish the adventure design job properly and release adventures where the DM plainly has to do WAY too much work to call it a finished product. Note: Paizo does not do this -- not even a little bit. It is a significant difference in the quality of the adventure products published by the two companies.
PF2 - Abomination Vaults or Kingmaker, until the inevitable RotRL Rev Ed for PF2 is released, that is. Or just play the unofficial PF2 conversion: GitHub - A-Series-of-Dice-Based-Events/RiseOfTheRunelords: A repository to hold tools for those wishing to run and convert RotR to Pathfinder 2E.)

Not yet mentioned -- but deserves to be? Chaosium's Masks of Nyarlothotep. It's a lot of fun, too. Still, it is very incomplete as initially released and thus the MON Companion is necessary to fix it and bring the whole thing together to present a more coherent whole.

 

[Zardnaar]

The correct answer is Rise of the Runelords Anniv Edition. Why? Because these people wrote it, while being guided by James Jacobs, who is the best architect/developer of adventures in the RPG business:

James Jacobs, Richard Pett, Nicolas Logue, Wolfgang Baur, Stephen S. Greer, Greg A. Vaughan. You can maybe quibble about Stephen Greer in the HoF and replace him with Tim Hitchcock for your 6 Hall of Famers, but there are lots who will say "keep him in".

That's why RotRL is the best. You can run it in 3.5, PF1, or convert it to PF2 or 5e. It's still the best AP overall where the authors were doing their DAMNDEST to save Paizo as a company.

And they did, too.

Main thing wrong with RotRL is level 10+.

Condensed version lvl 1-14 or so would be interesting.

 

[Steel_Wind]

Main thing wrong with RotRL is level 10+.

Condensed version lvl 1-14 or so would be interesting.

There is a difference between preferring low to mid-range play and eschewing high level (I certainly prefer low to mid-range, too and tend to avoid running high-level play if I can) and dissing portions of APs which are written for higher level (and are thus more challenging to write) but are nonetheless in spite of that challenge - excellent.

The Revised and Expanded "Skeletons of Scarwall" (Ch. 5 in Curse of the Crimson Throne Anniv Ed ) is probably the best haunted castle adventure of all time (yes, I6 included), with an outstanding map design. And THAT is saying something. You should try it before dissing it.

tl;dr: your biases are showing.

 

[Nightfly]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Curse of the Crimson Throne yet. It's for Pathfinder, but I found it pretty easy to convert to 5e on the fly. Plotting and NPCs are stupendous. Admittedly it might be a little shaky on your third and fifth points, and the "Skeletons of Scarwall" part is waaaay too long and needs some serious editing. (Sorry, Steel_Wind). But overall, a truly epic story.

 

[Steel_Wind]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Curse of the Crimson Throne yet. It's for Pathfinder, but I found it pretty easy to convert to 5e on the fly. Plotting and NPCs are stupendous. Admittedly it might be a little shaky on your third and fifth points, and the "Skeletons of Scarwall" part is waaaay too long and needs some serious editing. (Sorry, Steel_Wind). But overall, a truly epic story.

Ch. 5 in the Anniv Ed is about ~20% longer than the original Vol 5 for 3.5 was. The original map was so large, parts of it were undetailed. The Anniv Ed aimed to fix that - that was James Jacobs main mission in the Anniv Ed in terms of editorial changes.

Ch. 5 takes 25-30 hours to play, as written.

That is too long for one dungeon and so Ch. 5 presents an opportunity to layer an adventure vignette to take place outside of Scarwall to break this part of the adventure up - and you should do so, just as the adv text recommends. (By now, the PCs are teleporting or using other movement to get around between Korvosa and Scarwall).

 

[humble minion]

I read the original Curse of the Crimson Throne without playing it, but from memory (it's been maaaaany years...) one big objection to it at the time was that the final conflict in the last chapter was underwhelming. An entire party against a bard who didn't even have any particularly interesting minions to inspire?

 

[Zardnaar]

There is a difference between preferring low to mid-range play and eschewing high level (I certainly prefer low to mid-range, too and tend to avoid running high-level play if I can) and dissing portions of APs which are written for higher level (and are thus more challenging to write) but are nonetheless in spite of that challenge - excellent.

The Revised and Expanded "Skeletons of Scarwall" (Ch. 5 in Curse of the Crimson Throne Anniv Ed ) is probably the best haunted castle adventure of all time (yes, I6 included), with an outstanding map design. And THAT is saying something. You should try it before dissing it.

tl;dr: your biases are showing.

More because 3.x is a nightmare to play higher levels (DM pov).

I've never gone much past level 10ish in the 3.X APs 0% completed. Think Kingmaker made it to level 12-14 as an exception (pt4 iirc) but not 100% sure.

 

[amethal]

Red Hand of Doom takes a group from 6th to 12th level so just shy of the OP's 4-14 minimum criteria. It was a lot of fun to play through.

When I ran it, we played through Sunless Citadel and Forge of Fury first. It was quite easy to include some tie-ins to the Red Hand.

 

[HaroldTheHobbit]

My first encounter with Paizo APs is now with the Savage Pathfinder versions of RotRL and CotCT. I don't know about the d20 originals, but the Savaged conversions is the first commercial campaigns I've seen that actually is playable right out of the box without massive GM work. I'm running Rise now for my table, and spend most of my weekly prep time on an upcoming Travelleresque sci-fi campaign, since Rise run by itself with just minor adaptions and improv.

That in itself put them on the top of my list, but they actually have very good content too. Since I usually only run homebrews I warned my players that there will be some railroading - it's in the nature of pre-written material - but they are really enjoying Rise so far. Good stuff!

Edit: I guess I must nominate WFRP4e Enemy within too - the books and companions is filled to the brim with amazing material. It will be a couple of years before I have time to run it though.

 

[Steel_Wind]

I read the original Curse of the Crimson Throne without playing it, but from memory (it's been maaaaany years...) one big objection to it at the time was that the final conflict in the last chapter was underwhelming. An entire party against a bard who didn't even have any particularly interesting minions to inspire?

Agreed. I re-wrote the ending when I ran it, but that was principally because it had been out for nearly 10 years at that point and I wanted to surprise the players. (I also don't like irredeemable BBEGs who are set down the road to evil by an enchantment).

But yeah, final two battles are a bit weak in this one.

 

[Starfox]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Curse of the Crimson Throne yet. It's for Pathfinder, but I found it pretty easy to convert to 5e on the fly. Plotting and NPCs are stupendous. Admittedly it might be a little shaky on your third and fifth points, and the "Skeletons of Scarwall" part is waaaay too long and needs some serious editing. (Sorry, Steel_Wind). But overall, a truly epic story.

I played Curse of the Crimson throne, and it's ok, but I feel Hell's Rebels does a similiar theme better. Crimson Throne has that bait-and-switchin parts 4 and 5 where a party of city adventurers are suddenly supposed to live out barbarian challenges. Quite odd. This kind of bait and switch was common in the early adventure paths, Savage Tide had several (one at the start leaving town, another going planar) but Jade Regent (also Paizo) takes the prize!

The correct answer is Rise of the Runelords.

I converted RoR to 5E to learn and try that system, and that may have colored my opinion as we didn't like 4E. Still, my analysis is that RoR is a series of linked horror films - from children of the corn to haunted house, to urban horror, to slasher flic and so on. There was a too much gore for my taste.

On the history of adventure paths, I'd say the old G- D-Q series, literally the first series of adventures published, were a kind of adventure path. Even more so if you started with the (later published) slaver series. Lets just say that adventure & campaign writing has improved since then.

 

[humble minion]

I converted RoR to 5E to learn and try that system, and that may have colored my opinion as we didn't like 4E. Still, my analysis is that RoR is a series of linked horror films - from children of the corn to haunted house, to urban horror, to slasher flic and so on. There was a too much gore for my taste.

I really liked the general story arc of RotRL, and actually toyed with a complete reskin and port of it to 5e Dark Sun, with the Runelord being replaced by a lost sorcerer-king who fell into some sort of torpor or quiescence after completing the genocide that Rajaat assigned him. But it would have been a LOT of work for a campaign that I was unlikely to ever run, and I would have had to re-do almost all of the maps to get rid of all the forests and lakes and so on which are completely un-Dark-Sunnish, so the project petered out.

So Karzoug Gnoll-Eater slumbers on undisturbed in a forgotten mountain fastness far to the south-west of the Tyr Valley...

 

[Starfox]

reskin and port of it to 5e Dark Sun

What was to gross for my game would be prefect for Dark Sun.

 

[humble minion]

Some products which don't get talked about enough in AP threads though, are the Al-Qadim boxed sets. Most of them had an campaign booklet with a series of linked adventures that formed a campaign - though given the boxed sets were generally geographically themed, the adventures weren't always tightly linked enough to be considered a true adventure path, and the adventures themselves were often small and consisting of one fairly moderate dungeon.

Thousand And One Adventures was a good one, where the PCs were trying to unravel the history of a despised undead caliph of the past while dealing with a cult of flame mages. Assassin Mountain, where the PCs got involved in intrigue and treachery surrounding the leadership succession of an assassin brotherhood, and then there's Caravans, where the PCs try to reunite a star-crossed pair of childhood sweethearts late in life, with the aid of a prophetic magic carpet that eats poetry. My favourite was Ruined Kingdoms though. I can't say it's a genuinely good campaign out of the box because it jumps all over the place thematically and needs a lot of fleshing out, but the main storyline of reincarnation and legacies and awakened ancient evils, and its amazingly memorable first encounter have nagged at me to run it forever.

 

[Matchstick]

It probably doesn't fit all the criteria but if I were going to pick something like that for a new campaign I'd do Eyes of the Stone Thief. Unique premise and it can be engaged with almost constantly (or sparingly) pretty much all the way up from peasant to hero.

 

[edosan]

So everyone talking about these Pathfinder campaigns is making me want to take a look - what’s the best way to get these? What are the best versions of Runelords and Crimson Throne to get?

 

[Steel_Wind]

So everyone talking about these Pathfinder campaigns is making me want to take a look - what’s the best way to get these? What are the best versions of Runelords and Crimson Throne to get?

The Anniv Editions of both RotRL and CotCC for PF1 are the definitive versions of each to get. They are available in softcover and in PDF from from the Paizo store, (though I think they are out of the hardcover, at least mint versions of same.) You can find the hardcover out in the wild elsewhere for sale in the Usual Suspected places (FLGS, Amazon, et al).

paizo.com - Pathfinder Adventure Path: Rise of the Runelords Anniversary Edition (PFRPG)

paizo.com

paizo.com - Pathfinder Adventure Path: Rise of the Runelords Anniversary Edition Pocket Edition

paizo.com

paizo.com - Pathfinder Adventure Path: Curse of the Crimson Throne (PFRPG)

paizo.com

paizo.com - Pathfinder Adventure Path: Curse of the Crimson Throne Pocket Edition

paizo.com

If you are planning on running them under a different game system (5e, say), I would suggest just getting the PDF from Paizo.com, though you know best how you run your games and so which version you might like to buy. Perhaps you would be content with the softcover? Only you know what you need and prefer.

 

[MNblockhead]

I'd ding this pretty heavily on point #4. It was a sandbox of various different levels but part of the party's goals are laid out by the card reading that could (and did) lead the party into challenges very inappropriate for their level.

That was a feature not a bug for me and my group.

It creates a feel of danger and needing to find your footing in this new dangerous place the PCs have found themselves in.

 

[MNblockhead]

Am I the only one to never see or use these?

Nope. Totally missed the voting arrows until @CleverNickName pointed them out.

 

[MNblockhead]

Well, if you're on a mobile device, the arrows are down here, at the bottom of the post. Maybe that's why some folks haven't seen them?
↓ ↓ ↓

Nope, on a laptop. I'm just apparently not very observant.