Buck Rogers XXVc wasn't that bad a game.

[GAAAHHH]

I was gaming a lot at the time and I never saw it in stores. I remember seeing War against the Han, but I never saw the actual RPG.

 

[jdrakeh]

Having said that, the rules were essentially still 2e. From memory there was AC, HP and THAC0 although the skill/proficiency system was overhauled and much improved.

I didn't much care for the Buck Rogers setting but the rules were far and away the best implementation of the AD&D core resolution system ever published, IMHO. It was like "AD&D Lite" in many regards. Back in 1999 or so when I first read the rules, I recall thinking "Wow! I wish my D&D rules were this intuitive!"

 

[jdrakeh]

Besides, what exactly does "warehouses full of unsold product" mean?

Now might be a good time to mention that Ryan Dancey inventoried at least one warehouse full of unsold D&D products from that same time period

 

[darjr]

Warehouses of unsold 1st edition AD&D as well.

Hmmm... star frontiers canceled because of the Buck Rogers game? I never heard that. I was playing in a GURPS version of the Buck Rogers game's setting and actually really liked it.... but this puts a different light on things.

Shoot.

 

[Xyxox]

No, a lot of it had to do with Nerdrage over the cancellation of Star Frontiers which was at the time one of the most successful Science Fiction games on the market. People were upset that their favorite game was being replaced by Buck Rogers of all things and that they weren't going to get volume 2 of Zebulon's Guide. And was there any advertisement outside of Dragon Magazine? Then they were going after the fans that had just alienated or after AD&D fans who didn't care for anything if it didn't have elves and magic.

Don't get me wrong, I loved Star Frontiers. I was one of those outraged fans who refused to touch XXVc until I found it for half price years afterwards. I just wanted to fix the wonky damage system, the flat stellar map, and make the material in Zebulon's Guide match Alpha Dawn.

So, the OP is wrong, and actually didn't like the XXVc game? Sales has nothing to do whether the OP thought the game was a good one or not. I liked it too and wished I still had my copies, am I also wrong? Your argument is silly beyond imagining and completely irrelevant.

Besides, what exactly does "warehouses full of unsold product" mean? One warehouse? Twenty? Completely full, half full? Do you have an actual numeric figure of unsold units? And do you have any actual sales data? XXVc might've sold like gangbusters, but still have been overproduced leaving tons of unsold product. Your argument has no basis other than vague, second-hand reports of "tons of unsold product".

I have no idea personally how well XXVc sold or didn't sell, and I don't really care. I liked the board game they put out (still have that), I liked the RPG products they put out, and I liked the novels they put out. I pretty much liked the entire line.

You seem to have some sort of grudge against the game line, but, eh, who cares?

I was merely explaining what the marketplace determines is good or not.

According to the marketplace, Micrsoft Windows is the best operating system and American Idol is the most entertaining television program.



One unaltrerable fact about the decisions of the marketplace, however, is the fact that if it doesn't sell (or if it isn't consistently used such as Linux), it doesn't grow and it isn't supported.

 

[jdrakeh]

Hmmm... star frontiers canceled because of the Buck Rogers game?

I'm pretty sure that Star Frontiers was unofficially laid to rest years before either of the Buck Rogers games were published (I believe that the last SF products were published in 1985 or so, while the first BR products were published in 1990).

 

[Xyxox]

I'm pretty sure that Star Frontiers was unofficially laid to rest years before either of the Buck Rogers games were published (I believe that the last SF products were published in 1985 or so, while the first BR products were published in 1990).

According to the Wikipedia article, the last product printed for Star Frontiers was the first volume of "Zebulon's Guide to Frontier Space" in 1985.

According to the Wikipedia article, BR was first published in 1988.

I don't think we can blame the demise of a game in 1985 on another game that wasn't released for three more years, so you're dead on.

 

[jdrakeh]

According to the Wikipedia article, the last product printed for Star Frontiers was the first volume of "Zebulon's Guide to Frontier Space" in 1985.

I was pretty certain about that.

According to the Wikipedia article, BR was first published in 1988.

I don't think we can blame the demise of a game in 1985 on another game that wasn't released for three more years, so you're dead on.

I checked the publication date on XXVc at RPGNet, which I'm given to believe is more accurate than Wikipedia (as I think that somebody actually verfies their database entries). Amazon has it listed as 1990, as well. That said, I guess it's a moot point either way

 

[Xyxox]

I checked the publication date on XXVc at RPGNet, which I'm given to believe is more accurate than Wikipedia (as I think that somebody actually verfies their database entries). Amazon has it listed as 1990, as well. That said, I guess it's a moot point either way

You're right about the RPG. The first TSR BR XXVc novel was in 1989. It was the board game that was released in 1988.

 

[gribble]

According to the marketplace, Micrsoft Windows is the best operating system and American Idol is the most entertaining television program.

I realise this was tongue in cheek, but this is an oft repeated fallacy. The above claims are based on statistics gathering from sales and viewing information, and the only thing these statistics tell us is the MS Windows is the most installed operating system, and that American Idol is the most watched television program.
Analysts will make interpretations of what the data actually means, but that's all they are... interpretations. Certainly not objective measures of quality.