Bull Rush Question and feats to assist

[Arcanus]

I would think (this is only an opinion) that Wotc failed to mention an AoO with the Knockback enhancement being knocked 10feet is probally becuase you shouldn't be able to move 10 feet to take an AoO on the person who was knocked back 10 feet from the enhancement ability. ????????

Make any sense?

 

[kreynolds]

I would think (this is only an opinion) that Wotc failed to mention an AoO with the Knockback enhancement being knocked 10feet is probally becuase you shouldn't be able to move 10 feet to take an AoO on the person who was knocked back 10 feet from the enhancement ability. ????????

Make any sense?

It doesn't matter. By following the rationale that is not mine, if you knock someone back 10 feet with a knockback weapon, you may not be able to move and attack them, but if they pass through someone's space as they are knocked back, they can. Something like this should have been included in the Knockback description, but it wasn't. That makes me think that "being moved" doesn't apply in any way shape or form.

 

[Arcanus]

If You PASS BY a threatened space you might. You can't be knocked through a threatened space (can you? not sure on wording on the Knockback) if the space is already occupied you fall prone in or around that space. Wouldn't you? My opinion anyway.

 

[kreynolds]

If You PASS BY a threatened space you might. You can't be knocked through a threatened space (can you? not sure on wording on the Knockback) if the space is already occupied you fall prone in or around that space. Wouldn't you? My opinion anyway.

I don't mean being knocked back "through" an occupied space. Every individual threatens each square directly around them. I'm talking about getting knocked back 10-feet through these threatened squares. Does that make more sense?

 

[Mal Malenkirk]

I know what it says in the book but I just looked it up anyway. Nowhere does it say "if you are pushed back by a bullrusher, you might provoke AoO for moving in a threat zone."

Oh come on. It says exactly that.

PHB p.137, 2nd paragraph

Bull Rush results: If you beat the defender, you push him back 5 feet. If you wish to move with the defender, you can push him back up to a distance of an additional 1 foot for each point by which you exceed the defender's check result. (Note: The defender provokes attacks of opportunity if he is moved. So do you, if you move with him. The two of you do not provoke attacks of opportunity from each other as a result of this movement.)

Emphasis added by me.

This quotation also answer arcanus question; No you don't get an AoO against the creature that you are bullrushing. But your friends might.

 

[IceBear]

I see your main problem - you don't see a difference between moving 5ft and a 5ft step. The first is just normal movement. The other is your entire movement for the round and is considered a defensive repositioning.

You are only allowed one 5ft step per round, correct?

So, if someone used their 5ft step for the round they couldn't be bullrushed 5ft, because they've already taken their 5ft step for the round?

It has been asked, and clarified, that moving 5ft is NOT a 5ft step. If you don't want to believe that fine, but that's just being stubborn. You weren't here when that discussion took place, and thus it is fair that you didn't know about it, but that's the benefit of having long time board memebers around. We remember stuff that happened before and can pass it on.

Anyway, there is no point in continuing to debate this with you because we have fundamentally different views - I see a 5ft step and 5ft of movement as different things, you do not. Thus, we will always disagree with this.

IceBear

 

[kreynolds]

Oh come on. It says exactly that.

Thank you. That was the confirmation I had been looking for. Seems that you were the only person who read that passage closely. Thanks Mal! I accept all of it.

 

[kreynolds]

I see your main problem - you don't see a difference between moving 5ft and a 5ft step. The first is just normal movement. The other is your entire movement for the round and is considered a defensive repositioning.

You are only allowed one 5ft step per round, correct?

So, if someone used their 5ft step for the round they couldn't be bullrushed 5ft, because they've already taken their 5ft step for the round?

It has been asked, and clarified, that moving 5ft is NOT a 5ft step. If you don't want to believe that fine, but that's just being stubborn. You weren't here when that discussion took place, and thus it is fair that you didn't know about it, but that's the benefit of having long time board memebers around. We remember stuff that happened before and can pass it on.

Anyway, there is no point in continuing to debate this with you because we have fundamentally different views - I see a 5ft step and 5ft of movement as different things, you do not. Thus, we will always disagree with this.

IceBear

Ice, chill (no pun intended). I'm not that difficult. All it takes is a rule quote to instantly shut me up. Mal quoted, I thanked him, I understand now, it all works out great. But now, we have a new problem. Knockback weapons.

 

[kreynolds]

Thanks to those of you who helped clear this up. Mal, I really appreciate your careful eye for finding the rule, as nobody else did. Though, now, I am wondering if Knockback weapon enhancements are similar in regards to moving someone and taking an AoO. So...I started a new thread, as this one is getting cluttered. Once again, thanks to those of you that helped.

 

[IceBear]

Ice, chill (no pun intended). I'm not that difficult. All it takes is a rule quote to instantly shut me up. Mal quoted, I thanked him, I understand now, it all works out great. But now, we have a new problem. Knockback weapons.

Sorry, I've been reading so many threads on this lately that I mistakenly thought that the passage Mal gave was on page 1 of this thread. Thus, I was having a hard time why you couldn't see it Then I looked back at the thread and I saw that this was, indeed, the first time the actual rule was quoted in the thread.

Anyway, as it turned out it wasn't this thread that had this rule quote but one from last week regarding Mobility and Bull Rush.

Sorry for the mixup.

IceBear