D&D 5E Campaign Idea: Very Rare Magic Items at Lv. 1

[doppelgangerstudios]

no what if they all do... then what... how does your game continue once all disintegrated?

The PCs will be destroyed but there is still a campaign world full of vibrant NPCs that can do anything they set their hearts to (provided that it isn’t recovering, re-creating, or otherwise using the players Very Rare magic items)

 

[Mort]

it is mean spirited, but I think he thinks the players will be blown away by the surprises... but none of it is a surprise that seems worth it to me.

I ran a game where the PCs had a ton of gear (like this was 2e and using high level campaigns so like level 22+) and I hit them with a Mordicains disjunction... and blew up 1/3 of the items, then had the lich run. They not only had gotten warrnings he like to destroy items, but I had already placed clues to were there were epic level treasure they could go get...

that went badly. No one wanted to go get new cool things they were too mad they lost the old cool things

I've found players are often more attached to the PCs stuff than to the PCs themselves!

Taking away stuff, even when it's telegraphed, is always a tough sell!

 

[GMforPowergamers]

The PCs will be destroyed but there is still a campaign world full of vibrant NPCs that can do anything they set their hearts to (provided that it isn’t recovering, re-creating, or otherwise using the players Very Rare magic items)

the game... what happens next when these players who worked on characters ask "So what's next" do you just tell them a story about the NPCs, do the PCs come back (resurrection) or do you just end the game?

 

[Maxperson]

no what if they all do... then what... how does your game continue once all disintegrated?

Continue playing them in the Ghostwalk setting?

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Taking away stuff, even when it's telegraphed, is always a tough sell!

Yeah I was 17 when I learned that lesson back in 2e... I thought it would be like power rangers "lose 1 power up get a better one come back beat the bad guy" instead it ended the campaign and sowered everyone to playing high level games for a bit.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Continue playing them in the Ghostwalk setting?

I would say find a new DM first but sure

 

[Grantypants]

True, but part of the OP plot twist is that the PCs can't ever actually get the items back.

Consider this campaign where PCs can't get particular items back ever but hold false hope that they can. Now consider one where PCs can't get the items back until they beat the very last boss. There is no difference between these campaigns until the end of the last session where the PCs win and either do or don't get their items back.

And if retrieving the items isn't the main quest; if your goal is to have your PCs give up on getting the items back and have other adventures in a world that just no longer has these particular very rare magic items, that's... not really so big a deal. If missing these magic items isn't what's driving the plot, then your players will barely notice, especially as they gain levels and find other magic items.

 

[billd91]

Not to dog pile on here, but I don't see players reacting terribly well to this campaign. As has been said, you know your group better than we do, but a campaign in which they all start with something really nice that they chose, it's taken from them and they can't really do anything about it, and they can never get it back... you might as well lay a $100 bill on the ground and keep yanking it away with a string. At least that's over quickly.
Think of this from a player perspective. Are they going to see your point and enjoy chasing the unobtainable like some French arthouse film or are they going to get frustrated at being continually jerked around?

 

[Mort]

Consider this campaign where PCs can't get particular items back ever but hold false hope that they can. Now consider one where PCs can't get the items back until they beat the very last boss. There is no difference between these campaigns until the end of the last session where the PCs win and either do or don't get their items back.

And if retrieving the items isn't the main quest; if your goal is to have your PCs give up on getting the items back and have other adventures in a world that just no longer has these particular very rare magic items, that's... not really so big a deal. If missing these magic items isn't what's driving the plot, then your players will barely notice, especially as they gain levels and find other magic items.

Except that the entire proposed hook was that the players pick a fun powerful item. One they wouldn't normally ever see, and have their character start with that.

If that's the hook, and that hook is yanked away immediately - players are going to get (rightfully) salty.

Point is: Unless the DM has a well-established group that has grown to trust them from the perspective of having the group's "fun" fully in mind - bait and switch scenarios tend to go very, very poorly.

 

[doppelgangerstudios]

Continue playing them in the Ghostwalk setting?

I’d consider allowing players return as ghosts, holding the broken pieces of their Very Rare magic items as a testament to what they died over, a visible reminder of unfinished business. Ironically, if they kill the BBEG later, he will rest easy, moving to the afterlife since his goal is complete

 

[TwoSix]

This twist creates capability of drama and invention. There will be frequent flashbacks to the first 10 minutes of the campaign where the players held their magic items, stressing their loss and irreversible absence. It also may be a clue in of itself—say the PCs meet a roguish man who says “there are more amulets of the planes out there”—they’ll be able to deduce he’s a shifty character just saying what they want to hear (the truth being there was only one and now it’s gone and can’t be recreated)

It really doesn't. Players don't have expectations of certain items being in the game, so the loss of the potential to gain an item later doesn't carry a lot of weight.

And honestly, knowing that the DM has already pre-scripted 6 plot twists would be enough to make me walk away from a game. I have HBO Max and Netflix for pre-scripted dramas, I prefer my RPG experiences to be collaborative and improv-style.

 

[Wolfram stout]

Don't "spring" any of this on them. You do have some interesting ideas, but unless your players are so different from the vast majority here, it will not go over well.

Instead, make it the Campaign premise. Let them chose the very rare magic item knowing that it will be destroyed just prior to the start of the campaign, and that all similar magics are gone from the world. They might really like that. The first leg of the campaign is the same with them hunting down the BBEG. At that point they know the magic that was destroyed is truly gone, so the campaign would have to shift.

Maybe they look for ways to leave this world for another, or build new better magic that what was lost.

But a campaign of fruitless questing......is probably not going to be fun for them or for you in the long run.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

I’d consider allowing players return as ghosts, holding the broken pieces of their Very Rare magic items as a testament to what they died over, a visible reminder of unfinished business. Ironically, if they kill the BBEG later, he will rest easy, moving to the afterlife since his goal is complete

is there anyway you can run the game WITHOUT being an adversarial DM?

 

[Grantypants]

How about this for a final plot twist: BBEG was right. All magic items are inherently evil and the rest of the campaign is the party tracking magic items down and permanently destroying them. The BBEG was just doing his job until the PCs killed him for taking their stuff.

 

[doppelgangerstudios]

is there anyway you can run the game WITHOUT being an adversarial DM?

They can still play as the ghosts

 

[Krachek]

The BBEG is invulnerable during the first combat, as his hand is on the disintegration wand and he makes it clear that not only is he protected by powerful magic, he’ll reduce everyone to ashes if they attack outright.
This is later remedied when the find him around lv 4, fat and happy, no longer interested in adventuring or defense since he’s already accomplished his goal (irreconcilably destroying the objects the party most loved)

Then I wish you and your players to have fun with this introduction.

 

[Mort]

I’d consider allowing players return as ghosts, holding the broken pieces of their Very Rare magic items as a testament to what they died over, a visible reminder of unfinished business. Ironically, if they kill the BBEG later, he will rest easy, moving to the afterlife since his goal is complete

This again, sounds amusing for the (right) DM. But it sounds like you're actively TRYING to torture the players! It has to be fun for them too!

 

[doppelgangerstudios]

It really doesn't. Players don't have expectations of certain items being in the game, so the loss of the potential to gain an item later doesn't carry a lot of weight.

And honestly, knowing that the DM has already pre-scripted 6 plot twists would be enough to make me walk away from a game. I have HBO Max and Netflix for pre-scripted dramas, I prefer my RPG experiences to be collaborative and improv-style.

I’ve got some bad news for you about every adventure ever written that isn’t a straight up dungeon crawl or open world hex crawl. The dmg painstakingly describes writing campaign arcs—I never said that this is a closed world: in fact, I said there’s plenty of other action (determined as time goes on) it’s just that that action is wholly irrelevant to the item dilemma, which is set and settled from the jump

 

[GMforPowergamers]

it’s just that that action is wholly irrelevant to the item dilemma, which is set and settled from the jump

why though? what is the point of the gut punch of "go out of your way to pick an item I am going to take from you ha ha ha"

 

[TwoSix]

I’ve got some bad news for you about every adventure ever written that isn’t a straight up dungeon crawl or open world hex crawl. The dmg painstakingly describes writing campaign arcs—I never said that this is a closed world: in fact, I said there’s plenty of other action (determined as time goes on) it’s just that that action is wholly irrelevant to the item dilemma, which is set and settled from the jump

Which is precisely why I don't run them.

I mean, if you want to distill the worst excesses of '80s-90s GM-plotted trad RPGs into one scenario, and ignore the last 25 years or so of RPG design, more power to you. But I prefer my games to be oriented around either the players or the setting, not a metaplot. Whenever I see a game starting with "invulnerable NPC delivering exposition to force the PCs into a non-choice", my alarm bells go off.